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KSP2 had all the warning signs of being a disaster ever since the initial delays and controversies with the original studio. Unfortunately, as usual, the commun

KSP2 had all the warning signs of being a disaster ever since the initial delays and controversies with the original studio. Unfortunately, as usual, the community put on hype blinders until it became impossible to ignore.

TylerE 3y ago
I knew it was going to be a disaster as soon it became obvious that it was a continuation of the old code base, which has a lot of fundamental issues.
- mattsan 3y ago
  This is the first time I'm hearing it uses the old code base - do you have a source? I thought in the initial marketing they were big on saying it's a full rewrite.
  - SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
    You'd think if they were using the old code base they'd have more of the old features.
  - eterm 3y ago
    It might not use literal code (although it might), but there's definitely signs that some things like the terrain system were cribbed from KSP1, complete with the limitations of that system. Which means they've ended up in an awful state where even if they were competant (which they are not), best case things might not be much better. You're right they marketed it as a full re-write to avoid the problems ("Slay the Kraken"), but what was delivered was trash.
- gs17 3y ago
  I'm pretty sure it's not using much if any of the old code given how many bugs it had/has that don't exist in KSP1.
moffkalast 3y ago
And every time anyone mentioned any of that on the subreddit they got downvoted to oblivion, including myself. It's like everyone was (and to a smaller extent still is) on a heavy dose of weaponized hopium because the studio invested half their budget into a prerendered trailer. Even the youtubers that got to play the prerelease version pulled out every excuse in the book to not present what they saw objectively.
- dotnet00 3y ago
  Yeah, I had to unsub from the subreddit during the development years since everyone was eating up the hype videos and any attempt at questioning the lack of actual meaningful info was just downvoted and flamed. I still check the sub every once in a while though, and it seems like nowadays the hopium/copium is mostly gone. Player numbers are embarrassingly low and even the "most of the game is already done, they just want feedback and will quickly add in the promised features after refining" argument from launch is also undeniably dead with the total lack of new content. In terms of content creators, I very much appreciated Scott Manley having been up front with saying that he didn't recommend buying the game at launch given that he was THE original KSP-tuber.
- jonathankoren 3y ago
  Watching Matt Lowne’s KSP2 videos just makes me feel better about not buying. It’s just buggier and less. While I was interested in the surface colony stuff they promised for KSP2, the addition of another star system you could travel to was very disappointing. Not so much another system, but that you could travel to it. One thing I liked was that KSP was somewhat grounded in real physics. Practical interstellar travel just isn’t. (“bUt WiTh ALcUbIeRrE dRiVeS…” smack Shut up. They’re a fantasy.)
  - ilyt 3y ago
    Well, it's natural extension to endgame and players already liked mods doing that
    - jonathankoren 3y ago
ilyt 3y ago
The pitch showed they know what players want What they did so far showed they have nowhere near skill to pull it off
- jtriangle 3y ago
  To be fair, the users didn't ask for much by and large. They wanted better graphics and good physics with more game world to explore. That's not really a huge leap. The issue really is, as it is with many things, scope creep. In KSP2's case, it's scope creep to such an extent where, they have long forgotten what people loved about the original whimsy rocket building game. Like, better graphics really just needed to be better textures, and to make round things actually round. Good physics just needed to be "stuff doesn't randomly explode or become unstable while at rest". They absolutely could have done this... they just... didn't.
  - ilyt 3y ago
    > That's not really a huge leap. The issue really is, as it is with many things, scope creep. In KSP2's case, it's scope creep to such an extent where, they have long forgotten what people loved about the original whimsy rocket building game. I don't think that's the case. They clearly want to re-create the KSP1 things before going into more advanced stuff, the problem is that they can't even do that. Like, from the pitch it does seem that they know what players want, like starting from the get go with procedural wings, VAB improvements etc. but from results it's clear they don't have the chops
Aperocky 3y ago
KSP1 is really complete, especially if you are using OKAN and common mods that people install. I don't understand what they are trying to do with KSP2 to begin with. Skeptical from the start and it somehow turned out worse.
- ivanjermakov 3y ago
  The only complaint for modded KSP1 I have is loading times. I'm surprised devs didn't properly optimized that part.
  - Aperocky 3y ago
    that's a reasonable trade-off, to make a game that is so extensibly mod-able.
    - TylerE 3y ago
      Not so reasonable. A load with a decent but not crazy number of mods can be 10-15 minutes.
- TylerE 3y ago
  KSP1 has actually atrophied quite a bit, as many of mods that are essentially necessary for serious play no longer work with the newer versions.

TylerE 3y ago

I knew it was going to be a disaster as soon it became obvious that it was a continuation of the old code base, which has a lot of fundamental issues.

mattsan 3y ago
This is the first time I'm hearing it uses the old code base - do you have a source? I thought in the initial marketing they were big on saying it's a full rewrite.
- SketchySeaBeast 3y ago
  You'd think if they were using the old code base they'd have more of the old features.
- eterm 3y ago
  It might not use literal code (although it might), but there's definitely signs that some things like the terrain system were cribbed from KSP1, complete with the limitations of that system. Which means they've ended up in an awful state where even if they were competant (which they are not), best case things might not be much better. You're right they marketed it as a full re-write to avoid the problems ("Slay the Kraken"), but what was delivered was trash.
gs17 3y ago
I'm pretty sure it's not using much if any of the old code given how many bugs it had/has that don't exist in KSP1.

moffkalast 3y ago

And every time anyone mentioned any of that on the subreddit they got downvoted to oblivion, including myself. It's like everyone was (and to a smaller extent still is) on a heavy dose of weaponized hopium because the studio invested half their budget into a prerendered trailer. Even the youtubers that got to play the prerelease version pulled out every excuse in the book to not present what they saw objectively.

dotnet00 3y ago
Yeah, I had to unsub from the subreddit during the development years since everyone was eating up the hype videos and any attempt at questioning the lack of actual meaningful info was just downvoted and flamed. I still check the sub every once in a while though, and it seems like nowadays the hopium/copium is mostly gone. Player numbers are embarrassingly low and even the "most of the game is already done, they just want feedback and will quickly add in the promised features after refining" argument from launch is also undeniably dead with the total lack of new content. In terms of content creators, I very much appreciated Scott Manley having been up front with saying that he didn't recommend buying the game at launch given that he was THE original KSP-tuber.
jonathankoren 3y ago
Watching Matt Lowne’s KSP2 videos just makes me feel better about not buying. It’s just buggier and less. While I was interested in the surface colony stuff they promised for KSP2, the addition of another star system you could travel to was very disappointing. Not so much another system, but that you could travel to it. One thing I liked was that KSP was somewhat grounded in real physics. Practical interstellar travel just isn’t. (“bUt WiTh ALcUbIeRrE dRiVeS…” smack Shut up. They’re a fantasy.)
- ilyt 3y ago
  Well, it's natural extension to endgame and players already liked mods doing that
  - jonathankoren 3y ago

ilyt 3y ago

The pitch showed they know what players want What they did so far showed they have nowhere near skill to pull it off

jtriangle 3y ago
To be fair, the users didn't ask for much by and large. They wanted better graphics and good physics with more game world to explore. That's not really a huge leap. The issue really is, as it is with many things, scope creep. In KSP2's case, it's scope creep to such an extent where, they have long forgotten what people loved about the original whimsy rocket building game. Like, better graphics really just needed to be better textures, and to make round things actually round. Good physics just needed to be "stuff doesn't randomly explode or become unstable while at rest". They absolutely could have done this... they just... didn't.
- ilyt 3y ago
  > That's not really a huge leap. The issue really is, as it is with many things, scope creep. In KSP2's case, it's scope creep to such an extent where, they have long forgotten what people loved about the original whimsy rocket building game. I don't think that's the case. They clearly want to re-create the KSP1 things before going into more advanced stuff, the problem is that they can't even do that. Like, from the pitch it does seem that they know what players want, like starting from the get go with procedural wings, VAB improvements etc. but from results it's clear they don't have the chops

Aperocky 3y ago

KSP1 is really complete, especially if you are using OKAN and common mods that people install. I don't understand what they are trying to do with KSP2 to begin with. Skeptical from the start and it somehow turned out worse.

ivanjermakov 3y ago
The only complaint for modded KSP1 I have is loading times. I'm surprised devs didn't properly optimized that part.
- Aperocky 3y ago
  that's a reasonable trade-off, to make a game that is so extensibly mod-able.
  - TylerE 3y ago
    Not so reasonable. A load with a decent but not crazy number of mods can be 10-15 minutes.
TylerE 3y ago
KSP1 has actually atrophied quite a bit, as many of mods that are essentially necessary for serious play no longer work with the newer versions.