5 ms·

Excellent. I hope to see more games following suit away from the bloated messes of fandom/fextralife. At times they feel unusable on mobile. And I don't think a

by msp26 3y ago

Excellent. I hope to see more games following suit away from the bloated messes of fandom/fextralife. At times they feel unusable on mobile. And I don't think a single user has wanted to see the embedded twitch streams when they're just trying to get some information quickly.

tedivm 3y ago
Terraria moved their wiki and it's a much nice experience.
- LordShredda 3y ago
  It's a much much better experience, wiki.gg is a plain old wiki farm that just works
- hn_version_0023 3y ago
  I wish Valheim would follow suit
bakugo 3y ago
> And I don't think a single user has wanted to see the embedded twitch streams when they're just trying to get some information quickly. The embedded Twitch stream is there purely as a way to artificially boost viewer counts on their channel. Almost every time a new game comes out, you can go to its Twitch page and see Fextralife at the top with tens of thousands of viewers, with a dead chat because almost nobody is actually watching, it's all from the embed. Twitch-endorsed pseudo-viewbotting to farm ad revenue is a growing trend, there's even several systems on Twitch itself that encourage it, like the drops system.
- msp26 3y ago
  Don't advertisers care that they're wasting money? Or are they just unaware?
  - iamacyborg 3y ago
    The latter, mostly.
chx 3y ago
Path Of Exile Wiki has also moved about two years ago and GGG is providing hosting for a year now. https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3292958 https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3292958 https://www.poewiki.net/ https://www.poewiki.net/ The old fandom wiki is quite dead but it's impossible to get rid of it, alas.
- ye-olde-sysrq 3y ago
  OSRS also moved to oldschool.runescape.wiki and AIUI jagex pays for their hosting and provides some kind of content access to make updating/syncing easier. Plus they have RuneLite cooperating with crowdsourcing things like droptables and drop rates. (And of course mods often will outright tell them what certain droprates are or how they function).
  - Fergusonb 3y ago
    It's also available via the osrs.wiki URL. Also, it's the highest quality wiki I've ever encountered.
  - Reubachi 3y ago
    OSRS wiki isn't the best example. Jagex does not fund it, and is recommending they move to fandom/ad based support. Despite the OSRS wiki being legitimately the best website I use every day, it's leadership has been sounding the death knell every few months, always to an alarmingly quiet response. They have no money, have no revenue generator, and have a full staff that needs to be paid. The last post they put to the community mentioned moving back to fandom (crazy) or injecting ads at a pretty insane volume. So yes, fandom sucks. But also, a "normal" wiki takes expertise, and usually, compensation.
    - cookmeplox 3y ago
      I think you might have some of the facts wrong here - the post you're talking about never mentioned moving back to Fandom (nobody would ever entertain that option), and we ended up putting one pretty small ad in a pretty non-disruptive place, not "injecting ads at a pretty insane volume". In reality, we are doing fine on revenue, and more than covering the full-time labor costs by serving one ad to about 35% of users (really more like 20% after you account for ad blockers). It's still a bit icky compared to doing something donation-based or working directly with the studio, but neither of those would pay the bills. It turns out that a pretty small amount of advertising pays the bills just fine, which really puts into perspective how insane Fandom's monetization is. You can read more specifics/numbers in my post here: https://meta.weirdgloop.org/w/Forum:Mid-2023_business_update https://meta.weirdgloop.org/w/Forum:Mid-2023_business_update
chongli 3y ago
Yeah I really don't "get" fandom. It's an extremely steep price to pay for free hosting and config!
- coldpie 3y ago
  One big, big benefit is they handle account creation & anti-spam. Anti-spam is the hardest part of hosting, it's a serious problem and time-sink.
  - iamacyborg 3y ago
    I hosted the Path of Exile wiki for a while and account creation and anti-spam wasn't overly arduous.
cuongfu 3y ago
Somewhat relevant, but I know Baldur's Gate 3 is a huge game currently and seems they've done the same. bg3.wiki is infinitely more usable than the fandom one.
wlesieutre 3y ago
Star Citizen is another. I don't know if it "moved" so much as someone not connected to the earlier fandom wiki said "This sucks, I made a new one." https://starcitizen.tools/ https://starcitizen.tools/ https://starcitizen.fandom.com/ https://starcitizen.fandom.com/ And a recent post on reddit about the wiki's funding appears to have gotten their patreon up to $140 compared to $110 server costs. https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/16bo02n/star_citizen_tools_wiki_6000_articles_funding/ https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/16bo02n/star_c...
brazzledazzle 3y ago
There are times where if you stay on a fandom wiki too long on mobile you'll have a noticeable dent in battery percentage and a distinctly warmer phone. "Unusable" is being generous.
secret-noun 3y ago
> fextralife Yes, please let us get away from them. If you've ever browsed Twitch, you'll see them with tens of thousands of viewers... but when you join the channel, engagement is sparse. The reason this happens is because they embed their Twitch stream into every. page. you. visit. This is slimy, annoying, and slows the loading.
- n6h6 3y ago
  How is this not illegal / grounds for having the channel deleted?
  - majewsky 3y ago
    Why is Twitch not blocking a method for delivering their embedded video ads onto unrelated websites? Yeah, no idea.
    - Fnoord 3y ago
      The Twitch drops literally cause people to watch for X hours when they don't voluntary want to. I often have it running in my browser because I want the exclusive, yet I don't listen or watch.
98codes 3y ago
That Starfield launched with https://starfieldwiki.net/ https://starfieldwiki.net/ from the same people that have been running the (blessedly old school) Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages (UESP)* has been amazing -- being able to avoid Fandom is a top 10 feature of any game for me at this point. * https://uesp.net/ https://uesp.net/
tomodachi94 3y ago
The Feed The Beast Wiki (https://ftb.fandom.com https://ftb.fandom.com), a general-purpose modded Minecraft wiki, is also planning to move away in the next month or two. https://ftb.fandom.com/wiki/Project:CD#Forking_from_Fandom https://ftb.fandom.com/wiki/Project:CD#Forking_from_Fandom (n.b. I'm an admin there.) (n.b. 2, we've collaborated with MCW on several occasions)

by msp26 3y ago

tedivm 3y ago

Terraria moved their wiki and it's a much nice experience.

LordShredda 3y ago
It's a much much better experience, wiki.gg is a plain old wiki farm that just works
hn_version_0023 3y ago
I wish Valheim would follow suit

bakugo 3y ago

> And I don't think a single user has wanted to see the embedded twitch streams when they're just trying to get some information quickly. The embedded Twitch stream is there purely as a way to artificially boost viewer counts on their channel. Almost every time a new game comes out, you can go to its Twitch page and see Fextralife at the top with tens of thousands of viewers, with a dead chat because almost nobody is actually watching, it's all from the embed. Twitch-endorsed pseudo-viewbotting to farm ad revenue is a growing trend, there's even several systems on Twitch itself that encourage it, like the drops system.

msp26 3y ago
Don't advertisers care that they're wasting money? Or are they just unaware?
- iamacyborg 3y ago
  The latter, mostly.

chx 3y ago

Path Of Exile Wiki has also moved about two years ago and GGG is providing hosting for a year now. https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3292958 https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/3292958 https://www.poewiki.net/ https://www.poewiki.net/ The old fandom wiki is quite dead but it's impossible to get rid of it, alas.

ye-olde-sysrq 3y ago
OSRS also moved to oldschool.runescape.wiki and AIUI jagex pays for their hosting and provides some kind of content access to make updating/syncing easier. Plus they have RuneLite cooperating with crowdsourcing things like droptables and drop rates. (And of course mods often will outright tell them what certain droprates are or how they function).
- Fergusonb 3y ago
  It's also available via the osrs.wiki URL. Also, it's the highest quality wiki I've ever encountered.
- Reubachi 3y ago
  OSRS wiki isn't the best example. Jagex does not fund it, and is recommending they move to fandom/ad based support. Despite the OSRS wiki being legitimately the best website I use every day, it's leadership has been sounding the death knell every few months, always to an alarmingly quiet response. They have no money, have no revenue generator, and have a full staff that needs to be paid. The last post they put to the community mentioned moving back to fandom (crazy) or injecting ads at a pretty insane volume. So yes, fandom sucks. But also, a "normal" wiki takes expertise, and usually, compensation.
  - cookmeplox 3y ago
    I think you might have some of the facts wrong here - the post you're talking about never mentioned moving back to Fandom (nobody would ever entertain that option), and we ended up putting one pretty small ad in a pretty non-disruptive place, not "injecting ads at a pretty insane volume". In reality, we are doing fine on revenue, and more than covering the full-time labor costs by serving one ad to about 35% of users (really more like 20% after you account for ad blockers). It's still a bit icky compared to doing something donation-based or working directly with the studio, but neither of those would pay the bills. It turns out that a pretty small amount of advertising pays the bills just fine, which really puts into perspective how insane Fandom's monetization is. You can read more specifics/numbers in my post here: https://meta.weirdgloop.org/w/Forum:Mid-2023_business_update https://meta.weirdgloop.org/w/Forum:Mid-2023_business_update

chongli 3y ago

Yeah I really don't "get" fandom. It's an extremely steep price to pay for free hosting and config!

coldpie 3y ago
One big, big benefit is they handle account creation & anti-spam. Anti-spam is the hardest part of hosting, it's a serious problem and time-sink.
- iamacyborg 3y ago
  I hosted the Path of Exile wiki for a while and account creation and anti-spam wasn't overly arduous.

cuongfu 3y ago

Somewhat relevant, but I know Baldur's Gate 3 is a huge game currently and seems they've done the same. bg3.wiki is infinitely more usable than the fandom one.

wlesieutre 3y ago

Star Citizen is another. I don't know if it "moved" so much as someone not connected to the earlier fandom wiki said "This sucks, I made a new one." https://starcitizen.tools/ https://starcitizen.tools/ https://starcitizen.fandom.com/ https://starcitizen.fandom.com/ And a recent post on reddit about the wiki's funding appears to have gotten their patreon up to $140 compared to $110 server costs. https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/16bo02n/star_citizen_tools_wiki_6000_articles_funding/ https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/16bo02n/star_c...

brazzledazzle 3y ago

There are times where if you stay on a fandom wiki too long on mobile you'll have a noticeable dent in battery percentage and a distinctly warmer phone. "Unusable" is being generous.

secret-noun 3y ago

> fextralife Yes, please let us get away from them. If you've ever browsed Twitch, you'll see them with tens of thousands of viewers... but when you join the channel, engagement is sparse. The reason this happens is because they embed their Twitch stream into every. page. you. visit. This is slimy, annoying, and slows the loading.

n6h6 3y ago
How is this not illegal / grounds for having the channel deleted?
- majewsky 3y ago
  Why is Twitch not blocking a method for delivering their embedded video ads onto unrelated websites? Yeah, no idea.
  - Fnoord 3y ago
    The Twitch drops literally cause people to watch for X hours when they don't voluntary want to. I often have it running in my browser because I want the exclusive, yet I don't listen or watch.

98codes 3y ago

That Starfield launched with https://starfieldwiki.net/ https://starfieldwiki.net/ from the same people that have been running the (blessedly old school) Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages (UESP)* has been amazing -- being able to avoid Fandom is a top 10 feature of any game for me at this point. * https://uesp.net/ https://uesp.net/

tomodachi94 3y ago

The Feed The Beast Wiki (https://ftb.fandom.com https://ftb.fandom.com), a general-purpose modded Minecraft wiki, is also planning to move away in the next month or two. https://ftb.fandom.com/wiki/Project:CD#Forking_from_Fandom https://ftb.fandom.com/wiki/Project:CD#Forking_from_Fandom (n.b. I'm an admin there.) (n.b. 2, we've collaborated with MCW on several occasions)