3 ms·

> “We have small employers who don’t even know about the law,” said Kerbein, who predicted there would be “a lot of unintentional noncompliance.” Fair. But tha

> “We have small employers who don’t even know about the law,” said Kerbein, who predicted there would be “a lot of unintentional noncompliance.” Fair. But that's not how laws work. I may turn down a road not knowing that it's 35 and I get a ticket for going 45. Not knowing isn't an excuse.

jLaForest 3y ago
>Not knowing isn't an excuse True, unless you are a police officer: https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/12/when-cops-dont-know-the-law/383861/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/12/when-co...
hiatus 3y ago
Yet somehow police don't have to know the laws they are enforcing. Why do we allow good faith excuses for people carrying guns enforcing the law but give no favors to the general public. Do you know every single law you are subject to at the given moment? Even the US government does not know how many laws it has on its own books. https://blogs.loc.gov/law/2013/03/frequent-reference-question-how-many-federal-laws-are-there/ https://blogs.loc.gov/law/2013/03/frequent-reference-questio...
devoutsalsa 3y ago
IANAL, but I started googling and here's what I found... I've heard of "mens rea", which means in order for a crime to be committed, you need to have a "guilty mind". From what I can tell, ignorance of the law can be an excuse. If there's a law stating that wearing purple on Tuesdays is a criminal offense, and I wear purple on Tuesday, a prosecutor would have to prove that I knowingly & willingly committed a crime (e.g. showing a social media post where I saw "I'm going to wear purple this Tuesday. I dare you to arrest me!"). In the case of a traffic offense, ignorance of the law is typical not an excuse because a traffic not a criminal offense. Can a real lawyer comment here? Sources for my amateur legal assessment: - mens rea: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea - Actus Reus vs. Mens Rea vs. Strict Liability: https://shorylaw.com/actus-reus-vs-mens-rea-vs-strict-liability/ https://shorylaw.com/actus-reus-vs-mens-rea-vs-strict-liabil...
- BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
  Many traffic offenses do cross the line into criminal law. I also am not a lawyer, but I think the applicability of mens rea depends on whether it's written into the statute in question. When it comes to offenses like speeding, generally a part of obtaining a drivers license is accepting responsibility for knowing the rules of the road ahead of time.

jLaForest 3y ago

>Not knowing isn't an excuse True, unless you are a police officer: https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/12/when-cops-dont-know-the-law/383861/ https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/12/when-co...

hiatus 3y ago

Yet somehow police don't have to know the laws they are enforcing. Why do we allow good faith excuses for people carrying guns enforcing the law but give no favors to the general public. Do you know every single law you are subject to at the given moment? Even the US government does not know how many laws it has on its own books. https://blogs.loc.gov/law/2013/03/frequent-reference-question-how-many-federal-laws-are-there/ https://blogs.loc.gov/law/2013/03/frequent-reference-questio...

devoutsalsa 3y ago

IANAL, but I started googling and here's what I found... I've heard of "mens rea", which means in order for a crime to be committed, you need to have a "guilty mind". From what I can tell, ignorance of the law can be an excuse. If there's a law stating that wearing purple on Tuesdays is a criminal offense, and I wear purple on Tuesday, a prosecutor would have to prove that I knowingly & willingly committed a crime (e.g. showing a social media post where I saw "I'm going to wear purple this Tuesday. I dare you to arrest me!"). In the case of a traffic offense, ignorance of the law is typical not an excuse because a traffic not a criminal offense. Can a real lawyer comment here? Sources for my amateur legal assessment: - mens rea: https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea - Actus Reus vs. Mens Rea vs. Strict Liability: https://shorylaw.com/actus-reus-vs-mens-rea-vs-strict-liability/ https://shorylaw.com/actus-reus-vs-mens-rea-vs-strict-liabil...

BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
Many traffic offenses do cross the line into criminal law. I also am not a lawyer, but I think the applicability of mens rea depends on whether it's written into the statute in question. When it comes to offenses like speeding, generally a part of obtaining a drivers license is accepting responsibility for knowing the rules of the road ahead of time.