4 ms·

I could say the same about not making the move back to the office. Some of their best employees will prefer the office and will look for places where the cultur

by aflag 3y ago

I could say the same about not making the move back to the office. Some of their best employees will prefer the office and will look for places where the culture is for everyone to be in the office. I think I'm not alone in dreading working from home and being by myself in the office is not much better. What I really want is to work with other people at the same place.

tedivm 3y ago
The reality is it's easy to accommodate both. There are a ton of hybrid companies out there. If someone wants a desk in an office by all means give them one. Supporting both groups of people gives you the best talent pool to work with. People who demand their coworkers come into the office though- well, it's not something I've personally seen, but it would make me think the person is a bit of a control freak.
- cgeier 3y ago
  At least for people who like to come to the office (like me), this is even worse than working from home. You still spend lots of times in meetings in front of your computer, can't take those meetings in person, often can't solve quick issues on the way to lunch, and can't socialize with the people you are working with (which leads to getting to know people much quicker which IMHO makes working with people a lot easier).
  - tedivm 3y ago
    That's weird because I work remotely, socialize with my colleagues all the time, regularly solve problems for them in quick meetings, and generally don't encounter any of the concerns you do. Companies with bad cultures are going to have bad times regardless, culture definitely has to be managed. It is possible to build a remote or hybrid culture that works though.
    - aflag 3y ago
      How do you socialise? Do you have a zoom call with them over lunch when everyone eats together? If you need to draw something in a piece of paper to explain a concept or how a function behaves, how do you do that? Do you share your screen and draw everything with your mouse? If you want to show someone something you're writing do you start a call and share your screen with them? Then how do you and they point to stuff? What if they want to type in something? Do they just dictate? It's obviously all doable, but some people find that setup impersonal and annoying. Meanwhile, I have no trouble going to the office. It's nice to get out of the house, walk a bit. See other people going to work as well in the public transport. It all feels good to me.
  - walls 3y ago
    So many people eager to return to office seem to have confused work with their social life.
    - aflag 3y ago
      Work is part of social life. Your whole social life doesn't have to revolve around your best friend or wife or whatever people you chose. Living and socialising with people you didn't choose is important.
- aflag 3y ago
  I don't think hybrid is really accomodating to people who wants to be in the office. The main point in being in the office is to have all your colleagues around with you. My current place is hybrid, but thankfully my team is mostly always in. I really dislike when I need someone and I have to use slack or zoom to contact them. It's always a bit of a pain. A company where remote work is the exception (you need to wait for a parcel one day or something like that) appeals to me much more than a hybrid model. A full remote job I'd only consider it I were desperate.
  - jen20 3y ago
    > I really dislike when I need someone and I have to use slack Woe betide you if you try that even sat next to me in an open plan office. Your convenience is not my top priority when I have other things I want to be doing. There’s a reason that noise cancelling headphones are such a common sight in such places.
    - aflag 3y ago
      I'm by no means disrespectful of people who prefer to work in isolation. It's just not my preference.
  - freeopinion 3y ago
    Even 20 years ago coworkers were AIMing the person 2 cubicles over from them. It may not be for everyone, but remote messaging has been useful long before Covid.
    - bpicolo 3y ago
      For me there's a big difference between that and 6-8 hours of remote video calls in a day. Video calls are both mentally exhausting for me and highly unengaging.
      - tedivm 3y ago
        That's how I feel about meetings in general, regardless of whether they're in person or on video. At least with video I can turn off my camera when I need to blow my nose.
- mcv 3y ago
  And yet, having some people work from the office while others work from home, might actually be the worst of both worlds. A meeting works great if everybody is in the same room or everybody is online. It's awkward when half are in the same room filling one screen of an online meeting and being barely audible there. Everybody at home and using online chat tools to connect and work together works great, having your coworkers sitting next to you so you can have spontaneous meetings about technical details works great. But having two in the office and one online is awkward. Maybe we should separate into fully remote and fully at the office companies. For the record, WFH works great for me, but I also appreciate our one day per week at the office where I can see (nearly) all of my coworkers in real life.
hef19898 3y ago
One of those situations where a good balance seems to matter. But hey, people quit Amazon all the time, voluntary or not. And as long they are not low level logistics folks in a FC somewhere, there shouldn't be any difficulty in finding a job. Not sure why that even deserves an article.
oooyay 3y ago
I work for a company that has multiple offices world wide. We also have a pretty sizeable, entirely remote workforce as well. You can do both. I think the rub is that often the office crowd, in order to get their office, have to drag the remote crowd with them otherwise they're not getting what they want out of the office experience. Personally speaking, I will never work in an office again. I get more done working from home, I video chat with my colleagues all the time - even pairing, I meet up with them in cool places 2-4 times a year, and I have way more time for gardening, house projects, pets, and my partner without a 1-4 hour commute in a 24 hour day.
- ryandrake 3y ago
  > I think the rub is that often the office crowd, in order to get their office, have to drag the remote crowd with them otherwise they're not getting what they want out of the office experience. There might be a good business opportunity: Offer a "staff" of paid actors to go into a business, and walk around, having hallway and water cooler conversations, maybe drawing on whiteboards, and imitating the "buzz" of a robust office environment. That way, the people who like the office can bask in the ambience of a busy office, without having to force employees into the office that have no interest in that ambience!
- aflag 3y ago
  Yeah, Amazon is big enough that they could have a full stack group of employees always in the office and another one always remote. Almost like two companies. That's not the reality of most places though. Usually one has to pick.
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
pera 3y ago
At work we are hybrid but the reality is that very few people likes to go to the office, single digit % I would say. Sometimes I'm literally the only person in the entire building.
- aflag 3y ago
  We are dozens!

by aflag 3y ago

tedivm 3y ago

The reality is it's easy to accommodate both. There are a ton of hybrid companies out there. If someone wants a desk in an office by all means give them one. Supporting both groups of people gives you the best talent pool to work with. People who demand their coworkers come into the office though- well, it's not something I've personally seen, but it would make me think the person is a bit of a control freak.

cgeier 3y ago
At least for people who like to come to the office (like me), this is even worse than working from home. You still spend lots of times in meetings in front of your computer, can't take those meetings in person, often can't solve quick issues on the way to lunch, and can't socialize with the people you are working with (which leads to getting to know people much quicker which IMHO makes working with people a lot easier).
- tedivm 3y ago
  That's weird because I work remotely, socialize with my colleagues all the time, regularly solve problems for them in quick meetings, and generally don't encounter any of the concerns you do. Companies with bad cultures are going to have bad times regardless, culture definitely has to be managed. It is possible to build a remote or hybrid culture that works though.
  - aflag 3y ago
    How do you socialise? Do you have a zoom call with them over lunch when everyone eats together? If you need to draw something in a piece of paper to explain a concept or how a function behaves, how do you do that? Do you share your screen and draw everything with your mouse? If you want to show someone something you're writing do you start a call and share your screen with them? Then how do you and they point to stuff? What if they want to type in something? Do they just dictate? It's obviously all doable, but some people find that setup impersonal and annoying. Meanwhile, I have no trouble going to the office. It's nice to get out of the house, walk a bit. See other people going to work as well in the public transport. It all feels good to me.
- walls 3y ago
  So many people eager to return to office seem to have confused work with their social life.
  - aflag 3y ago
    Work is part of social life. Your whole social life doesn't have to revolve around your best friend or wife or whatever people you chose. Living and socialising with people you didn't choose is important.
aflag 3y ago
I don't think hybrid is really accomodating to people who wants to be in the office. The main point in being in the office is to have all your colleagues around with you. My current place is hybrid, but thankfully my team is mostly always in. I really dislike when I need someone and I have to use slack or zoom to contact them. It's always a bit of a pain. A company where remote work is the exception (you need to wait for a parcel one day or something like that) appeals to me much more than a hybrid model. A full remote job I'd only consider it I were desperate.
- jen20 3y ago
  > I really dislike when I need someone and I have to use slack Woe betide you if you try that even sat next to me in an open plan office. Your convenience is not my top priority when I have other things I want to be doing. There’s a reason that noise cancelling headphones are such a common sight in such places.
  - aflag 3y ago
    I'm by no means disrespectful of people who prefer to work in isolation. It's just not my preference.
- freeopinion 3y ago
  Even 20 years ago coworkers were AIMing the person 2 cubicles over from them. It may not be for everyone, but remote messaging has been useful long before Covid.
  - bpicolo 3y ago
    For me there's a big difference between that and 6-8 hours of remote video calls in a day. Video calls are both mentally exhausting for me and highly unengaging.
    - tedivm 3y ago
      That's how I feel about meetings in general, regardless of whether they're in person or on video. At least with video I can turn off my camera when I need to blow my nose.
mcv 3y ago
And yet, having some people work from the office while others work from home, might actually be the worst of both worlds. A meeting works great if everybody is in the same room or everybody is online. It's awkward when half are in the same room filling one screen of an online meeting and being barely audible there. Everybody at home and using online chat tools to connect and work together works great, having your coworkers sitting next to you so you can have spontaneous meetings about technical details works great. But having two in the office and one online is awkward. Maybe we should separate into fully remote and fully at the office companies. For the record, WFH works great for me, but I also appreciate our one day per week at the office where I can see (nearly) all of my coworkers in real life.

hef19898 3y ago

One of those situations where a good balance seems to matter. But hey, people quit Amazon all the time, voluntary or not. And as long they are not low level logistics folks in a FC somewhere, there shouldn't be any difficulty in finding a job. Not sure why that even deserves an article.

oooyay 3y ago

I work for a company that has multiple offices world wide. We also have a pretty sizeable, entirely remote workforce as well. You can do both. I think the rub is that often the office crowd, in order to get their office, have to drag the remote crowd with them otherwise they're not getting what they want out of the office experience. Personally speaking, I will never work in an office again. I get more done working from home, I video chat with my colleagues all the time - even pairing, I meet up with them in cool places 2-4 times a year, and I have way more time for gardening, house projects, pets, and my partner without a 1-4 hour commute in a 24 hour day.

ryandrake 3y ago
> I think the rub is that often the office crowd, in order to get their office, have to drag the remote crowd with them otherwise they're not getting what they want out of the office experience. There might be a good business opportunity: Offer a "staff" of paid actors to go into a business, and walk around, having hallway and water cooler conversations, maybe drawing on whiteboards, and imitating the "buzz" of a robust office environment. That way, the people who like the office can bask in the ambience of a busy office, without having to force employees into the office that have no interest in that ambience!
aflag 3y ago
Yeah, Amazon is big enough that they could have a full stack group of employees always in the office and another one always remote. Almost like two companies. That's not the reality of most places though. Usually one has to pick.

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

pera 3y ago

At work we are hybrid but the reality is that very few people likes to go to the office, single digit % I would say. Sometimes I'm literally the only person in the entire building.

aflag 3y ago
We are dozens!