3 ms·

There are five workers supporting every retiree, and this is still happening. If you are approaching 40, there will be about two workers supporting you when yo

There are five workers supporting every retiree, and this is still happening. If you are approaching 40, there will be about two workers supporting you when you retire. I’m thinking this is the start of something much bigger.

Ensorceled 3y ago
Yes, this is why the "it's immigration" comments are incredibly naive. Immigration is trying to prop up this system.
- betaby 3y ago
  Doesn't seem to work in Canada.
  - Ensorceled 3y ago
    Didn't say it's working :-/ Canada has two major problems with immigration right now: 1) the rapid increase in numbers is a shock that the immigration systems (including immigrant community resources) can't handle, that shock is exacerbating the housing crisis (and health care crisis and ...) 2) the family reunification program defeats one of the major purposes of immigration, increase the ratio of working age citizens to elderly citizens. I say this as someone who has traditionally been pretty gung ho about immigration.
    - username_my1 3y ago
      No way immigration doesn't help, I see this in germany help so many startups enter the market and build successful businesses that drive the economy. The problem is that it's not a solution, the solution is to constantly push against inequility and increase social mobility while investing in productive industries (less housing speculations more manufacturing). those are tough bills to swallow and they will lead any elected goverment out of the office, because strong shifts to an economy like this come with a lot of short term pain. and no one is willing to setdown and deal with 10 years of poor economy so that the future of the country is better.
      - Ensorceled 3y ago
        > No way immigration doesn't help Traditionally, it has been helping. It's not been helping for a couple of years now. > strong shifts to an economy like this come with a lot of short term pain. and no one is willing to setdown and deal with 10 years of poor economy so that the future of the country is better. This is the problem in a nutshell, we need to make changes and we can't stomach it politically.
- landoftheice 3y ago
  [dead]
- TjZkxkxeky 3y ago
  Is that why Japan's elderly are all homeless?
  - mensetmanusman 3y ago
    Japan has an over-abundance of housing.
    - tomjakubowski 3y ago
      Given the declining population predicted by OP, US housing stock will also grow in abundance by the time young people hit retirement age.
    - csomar 3y ago
      That's interesting given that land is very scarce in Japan. Suddenly, they decided to all squeeze together, make it clean and also be patient with one another. Something tells me this is about societal culture more than anything else.
- thehappypm 3y ago
  Immigration also makes housing scarcer, and housing is the biggest CoL problem.
pizzafeelsright 3y ago
Here I am one worker supporting three. I am not retiring.
hotpotamus 3y ago
Aren't we supposed to be incredibly productive compared to a century ago? "We" (not me) certainly have more megayachts and private jets traversing the Earth than we did. You'd think we could afford some housing to go around, but I'm far from naive enough to believe that we'll solve this or any problem facing us at this point.
- jeroenhd 3y ago
  Production has definitely increased, but wages (and therefore things like income taxes to fund welfare for the elderly) haven't scaled with the increase in production. Pages like these (https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/ https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/) have a whole bunch of numbers and graphs detailing the difference. Increasing productivity doesn't fix the loss of workers per retiree if the profits of that productivity only flow to the top. This can be fixed, but I don't expect a massive increase in wages at the cost of shareholder returns happening any time soon. I think it's more likely that those who haven't saved and invested enough to compensate for the shifting economic landscape (or those who made bad investments) will just end up with a lower standard of living than the previous generations of retirees.
- Exoristos 3y ago
  It's perfectly possible to solve all society's problems. We simply lack the political will and moral fortitude.
  - npteljes 3y ago
    We must lack something else too. And I'm not saying this ironically. So far, no utopias succeeded, and that must be for valid reasons.
TimesOldRoman 3y ago
Interesting way to look at it; # ppl supporting the retired.

Ensorceled 3y ago

Yes, this is why the "it's immigration" comments are incredibly naive. Immigration is trying to prop up this system.

betaby 3y ago
Doesn't seem to work in Canada.
- Ensorceled 3y ago
  Didn't say it's working :-/ Canada has two major problems with immigration right now: 1) the rapid increase in numbers is a shock that the immigration systems (including immigrant community resources) can't handle, that shock is exacerbating the housing crisis (and health care crisis and ...) 2) the family reunification program defeats one of the major purposes of immigration, increase the ratio of working age citizens to elderly citizens. I say this as someone who has traditionally been pretty gung ho about immigration.
  - username_my1 3y ago
    No way immigration doesn't help, I see this in germany help so many startups enter the market and build successful businesses that drive the economy. The problem is that it's not a solution, the solution is to constantly push against inequility and increase social mobility while investing in productive industries (less housing speculations more manufacturing). those are tough bills to swallow and they will lead any elected goverment out of the office, because strong shifts to an economy like this come with a lot of short term pain. and no one is willing to setdown and deal with 10 years of poor economy so that the future of the country is better.
    - Ensorceled 3y ago
      > No way immigration doesn't help Traditionally, it has been helping. It's not been helping for a couple of years now. > strong shifts to an economy like this come with a lot of short term pain. and no one is willing to setdown and deal with 10 years of poor economy so that the future of the country is better. This is the problem in a nutshell, we need to make changes and we can't stomach it politically.
landoftheice 3y ago
[dead]
TjZkxkxeky 3y ago
Is that why Japan's elderly are all homeless?
- mensetmanusman 3y ago
  Japan has an over-abundance of housing.
  - tomjakubowski 3y ago
    Given the declining population predicted by OP, US housing stock will also grow in abundance by the time young people hit retirement age.
  - csomar 3y ago
    That's interesting given that land is very scarce in Japan. Suddenly, they decided to all squeeze together, make it clean and also be patient with one another. Something tells me this is about societal culture more than anything else.
thehappypm 3y ago
Immigration also makes housing scarcer, and housing is the biggest CoL problem.

pizzafeelsright 3y ago

Here I am one worker supporting three. I am not retiring.

hotpotamus 3y ago

Aren't we supposed to be incredibly productive compared to a century ago? "We" (not me) certainly have more megayachts and private jets traversing the Earth than we did. You'd think we could afford some housing to go around, but I'm far from naive enough to believe that we'll solve this or any problem facing us at this point.

jeroenhd 3y ago
Production has definitely increased, but wages (and therefore things like income taxes to fund welfare for the elderly) haven't scaled with the increase in production. Pages like these (https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/ https://www.epi.org/productivity-pay-gap/) have a whole bunch of numbers and graphs detailing the difference. Increasing productivity doesn't fix the loss of workers per retiree if the profits of that productivity only flow to the top. This can be fixed, but I don't expect a massive increase in wages at the cost of shareholder returns happening any time soon. I think it's more likely that those who haven't saved and invested enough to compensate for the shifting economic landscape (or those who made bad investments) will just end up with a lower standard of living than the previous generations of retirees.
Exoristos 3y ago
It's perfectly possible to solve all society's problems. We simply lack the political will and moral fortitude.
- npteljes 3y ago
  We must lack something else too. And I'm not saying this ironically. So far, no utopias succeeded, and that must be for valid reasons.

TimesOldRoman 3y ago

Interesting way to look at it; # ppl supporting the retired.