4 ms·

I agree personally but you’ll find that servers will push hardest against this. It’s possible for them to do much better than the “decent wage” they’d be paid o

by jghn 3y ago

I agree personally but you’ll find that servers will push hardest against this. It’s possible for them to do much better than the “decent wage” they’d be paid otherwise. I have friends in the industry who clear 50 or even 100/hr. That’s going to be hard to proce into menu prices

xattt 3y ago
How do Australian wages and prices compare?
- jpgvm 3y ago
  Wages for hospitality are higher when compared on distance to the median/indexed for COL. i.e it's a liveable wage but not a glamorous one. Prices in Australia are more evenly distributed. In the US high COL cities like San Francisco have much higher prices than butt fuck nowhere Omaha. In Australia there is still a delta but it's much much smaller. As a result prices in high COL Australian cities like Melbourne and Sydney are generally cheaper than the equivalent SF/LA/NY prices but rural areas in Australia are much more expensive than rural areas in the US.
coryrc 3y ago
It's already being paid though. It'll just be the owner has better leverage to keep more for themselves.
- jghn 3y ago
  Mentioned this in another comment but one thing to consider is patronage at a restaurant is very spiky. Busy shifts and slow shifts. Paying all servers say 50-100/hr and raising menu prices to match would be prohibitive as the quiet shifts would kill them. Not requiring tipping but any model that allows pay to scale to volume would account for this. We see something similar where I live, restaurants are adding a %age based fee to go direct to kitchen staff. In my state tips can’t be split with BOH staff. This allows the owner to pay the BOH stadf more but scale it to actual volume
dangus 3y ago
IMO the servers who advocate for this are doing it at the expense of their peers who are more discriminated against (like if they’re unattractive or a minority race that faces discrimination). The history of tipping in the United States is that it was used to pay Black people less or not at all after the abolition of slavery. White service workers would get big tips and Black servers wouldn’t. This pay gap persists to this day: https://www.outtraveler.com/eat-drink/2021/2/06/black-workers-tipped-less-punished-more-during-pandemic https://www.outtraveler.com/eat-drink/2021/2/06/black-worker...
consp 3y ago
Are those people in anyway the average? Sounds more like the exception to me and thus not really the problem or solution.
- jghn 3y ago
  Work at a decent restaurant/bar in a larger city. The one thing the tip model does help with is providing a “congestion fee” of sorts. A server in the joints in describing making really good money - if the restaurant was paying say $50/hr it wouldn’t be feasible as patronage at the restaurant is very spiky and margins are low. This allows restaurants to effectively pay more during busier periods and less during quiet periods. I suppose the same could be done by scaling pay rate by shift.
  - analog31 3y ago
    Like "piece work" in factories.

by jghn 3y ago

xattt 3y ago

How do Australian wages and prices compare?

jpgvm 3y ago
Wages for hospitality are higher when compared on distance to the median/indexed for COL. i.e it's a liveable wage but not a glamorous one. Prices in Australia are more evenly distributed. In the US high COL cities like San Francisco have much higher prices than butt fuck nowhere Omaha. In Australia there is still a delta but it's much much smaller. As a result prices in high COL Australian cities like Melbourne and Sydney are generally cheaper than the equivalent SF/LA/NY prices but rural areas in Australia are much more expensive than rural areas in the US.

coryrc 3y ago

It's already being paid though. It'll just be the owner has better leverage to keep more for themselves.

jghn 3y ago
Mentioned this in another comment but one thing to consider is patronage at a restaurant is very spiky. Busy shifts and slow shifts. Paying all servers say 50-100/hr and raising menu prices to match would be prohibitive as the quiet shifts would kill them. Not requiring tipping but any model that allows pay to scale to volume would account for this. We see something similar where I live, restaurants are adding a %age based fee to go direct to kitchen staff. In my state tips can’t be split with BOH staff. This allows the owner to pay the BOH stadf more but scale it to actual volume

dangus 3y ago

IMO the servers who advocate for this are doing it at the expense of their peers who are more discriminated against (like if they’re unattractive or a minority race that faces discrimination). The history of tipping in the United States is that it was used to pay Black people less or not at all after the abolition of slavery. White service workers would get big tips and Black servers wouldn’t. This pay gap persists to this day: https://www.outtraveler.com/eat-drink/2021/2/06/black-workers-tipped-less-punished-more-during-pandemic https://www.outtraveler.com/eat-drink/2021/2/06/black-worker...

consp 3y ago

Are those people in anyway the average? Sounds more like the exception to me and thus not really the problem or solution.

jghn 3y ago
Work at a decent restaurant/bar in a larger city. The one thing the tip model does help with is providing a “congestion fee” of sorts. A server in the joints in describing making really good money - if the restaurant was paying say $50/hr it wouldn’t be feasible as patronage at the restaurant is very spiky and margins are low. This allows restaurants to effectively pay more during busier periods and less during quiet periods. I suppose the same could be done by scaling pay rate by shift.
- analog31 3y ago
  Like "piece work" in factories.