4 ms·

My father purchased a house in Melbourne in the late 70’s, and he paid the mortgage completely in 3.5 years as a physical labourer. Most of his generation did t

My father purchased a house in Melbourne in the late 70’s, and he paid the mortgage completely in 3.5 years as a physical labourer. Most of his generation did the same. Today as a senior engineer I would need 35 years to pay off that very same home. Hence why I moved away from Australia to south east Europe, now the 1.46ha block of land and big house on an estate set me back 3 yearly salaries. Income tax is lower, and lifestyle cheaper. I know 4 other families (friends) that did the same. Expect an exodus from Australia.

Izikiel43 3y ago
Croatia?
zemvpferreira 3y ago
Out of curiosity, where did you move?
- dathinab 3y ago
  many rual areas in the EU are quite affordable through local rual infrastructure e.g. doctors, hospitals, Kindergarten is in many areas in decline depending on where internet on the other hand can often be good enough through material and personal cost for renovation can still be a problem
rafaelmn 3y ago
Where in southeast Europe are we talking about here ? I'm from Croatia and what you're describing only checks out if you live in rural/undesirable area IMO. This has huge implications on QoL : - social circles - schools/kindergarten and socialisation for your children (if you have them of course) - usually worse pollution than city ironically, unless you're really isolated (a lot of these villages have terrible wood burning chimneys, usually some dirty factories etc., smell from farming/primitive animal styes in the area and zero regard for ecology/enforcement of environmental standards) - bad infrastructure (common electrical outages, terrible internet), transportation options (highways are decent), hospitals For example a 100m2 newly built apartment in a middle class area will cost you ~400k€ (can be a bit less but expect significant tradeoffs). A house of similar quality will probably be 5-600k+. Realestate inflation changes the equation of living here substantially - it used to be you could remote for 30% less money and live way above the standard you could get in more expensive countries. Now the lifestyle is not significantly more attainable and everything else is worse than in richer countries.
- markky 3y ago
  I agree with you on quality housing being costly and scarce. But living in SE Europe/Croatia can pay off if you can survive with lower standards for a while. For example, you could buy a flat in urban area for 150k€ of lower quality and, if you are working for a non local company, you can pay it off quickly. Then you can start climbing on the housing ladder. You probably cannot do that in other more developed countries.
  - rafaelmn 3y ago
    This is true but you're also living in a significantly less developed environment/society. And the widespread corruption/crime in society is depressing - you're competing for high quality realestate with these people and they will be your neighbours/social circle. Also a lot of work capable population is moving to higher standard countries (brain drain). 1/3 of my childhood friends already left. Like you said a lot of stuff is still cheaper, income tax is insanely low if you're contracting (~22% tax total). It's definitely a trade-off. TBH if I didn't already have a child I'd be moving west - and even now I'm seriously considering it instead of doing an "upgrade" here like you say.
- smallstepforman 3y ago
  Serbia, 9km from Belgrade, got fibre, gas, and the usuals. Vikendaško naselje. 15 min by car from 2 big private schools, 20min from nearest big shopping center, 25min from Galerija (elite shopping), 25 min to airport, 30 min to downtown belgrade. Also got public train (800m) and bus stop (200m). On a hill (320m), wind intersecction, also got an actual spring on the property. Who wants to live in polluted Belgrade though? I’ve also got Croatian passport, considered Istra (Pula), but no private schools, and much higher taxes. By car I’m in Pula in 6 hours.
- ulfw 3y ago
  Exactly this. And 400K EUR = 660K AUD. There's apartments to be found in Australia for that, especially when you're not in crazy expensive Sydney (e.g. Perth, Adelaide, Brizzy or Melbourne to name just the bigger cities. Much cheaper when you go to smaller towns. No need to move half way across the world for that)
raincom 3y ago
If Australia can open doors for immigrants, so many qualified folks from the third world can immigrate to Australia to replace the exodus.
- RestlessMind 3y ago
  per capita immigration is already higher in Australia than in the US: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/immigration-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/immigrati...
ulfw 3y ago
LOL. Yea sorry but no. I don't expect an exodus from Australia to Bulgaria or Romania. I just really ain't seeing it. And neither do statistics show anything like it.

Izikiel43 3y ago

Croatia?

zemvpferreira 3y ago

Out of curiosity, where did you move?

dathinab 3y ago
many rual areas in the EU are quite affordable through local rual infrastructure e.g. doctors, hospitals, Kindergarten is in many areas in decline depending on where internet on the other hand can often be good enough through material and personal cost for renovation can still be a problem

rafaelmn 3y ago

Where in southeast Europe are we talking about here ? I'm from Croatia and what you're describing only checks out if you live in rural/undesirable area IMO. This has huge implications on QoL : - social circles - schools/kindergarten and socialisation for your children (if you have them of course) - usually worse pollution than city ironically, unless you're really isolated (a lot of these villages have terrible wood burning chimneys, usually some dirty factories etc., smell from farming/primitive animal styes in the area and zero regard for ecology/enforcement of environmental standards) - bad infrastructure (common electrical outages, terrible internet), transportation options (highways are decent), hospitals For example a 100m2 newly built apartment in a middle class area will cost you ~400k€ (can be a bit less but expect significant tradeoffs). A house of similar quality will probably be 5-600k+. Realestate inflation changes the equation of living here substantially - it used to be you could remote for 30% less money and live way above the standard you could get in more expensive countries. Now the lifestyle is not significantly more attainable and everything else is worse than in richer countries.

markky 3y ago
I agree with you on quality housing being costly and scarce. But living in SE Europe/Croatia can pay off if you can survive with lower standards for a while. For example, you could buy a flat in urban area for 150k€ of lower quality and, if you are working for a non local company, you can pay it off quickly. Then you can start climbing on the housing ladder. You probably cannot do that in other more developed countries.
- rafaelmn 3y ago
  This is true but you're also living in a significantly less developed environment/society. And the widespread corruption/crime in society is depressing - you're competing for high quality realestate with these people and they will be your neighbours/social circle. Also a lot of work capable population is moving to higher standard countries (brain drain). 1/3 of my childhood friends already left. Like you said a lot of stuff is still cheaper, income tax is insanely low if you're contracting (~22% tax total). It's definitely a trade-off. TBH if I didn't already have a child I'd be moving west - and even now I'm seriously considering it instead of doing an "upgrade" here like you say.
smallstepforman 3y ago
Serbia, 9km from Belgrade, got fibre, gas, and the usuals. Vikendaško naselje. 15 min by car from 2 big private schools, 20min from nearest big shopping center, 25min from Galerija (elite shopping), 25 min to airport, 30 min to downtown belgrade. Also got public train (800m) and bus stop (200m). On a hill (320m), wind intersecction, also got an actual spring on the property. Who wants to live in polluted Belgrade though? I’ve also got Croatian passport, considered Istra (Pula), but no private schools, and much higher taxes. By car I’m in Pula in 6 hours.
ulfw 3y ago
Exactly this. And 400K EUR = 660K AUD. There's apartments to be found in Australia for that, especially when you're not in crazy expensive Sydney (e.g. Perth, Adelaide, Brizzy or Melbourne to name just the bigger cities. Much cheaper when you go to smaller towns. No need to move half way across the world for that)

raincom 3y ago

If Australia can open doors for immigrants, so many qualified folks from the third world can immigrate to Australia to replace the exodus.

RestlessMind 3y ago
per capita immigration is already higher in Australia than in the US: https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/immigration-by-country https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/immigrati...

ulfw 3y ago

LOL. Yea sorry but no. I don't expect an exodus from Australia to Bulgaria or Romania. I just really ain't seeing it. And neither do statistics show anything like it.