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It’s frankly a shame we’ve gotten to the point where the other side is an enemy. Washington and Adams strongly believed parties shouldn’t exist in America beca

It’s frankly a shame we’ve gotten to the point where the other side is an enemy. Washington and Adams strongly believed parties shouldn’t exist in America because of this. Jefferson manipulated the situation to his advantage and won, enshrining the enshitification of American politics in just the way Washington and Adams feared it would.

EA-3167 3y ago
I'm too much of a cynic to believe that this was anything, but inevitable. It's not as though countries with many parties or no parties are somehow less divided right now. And frankly when one party led to what we saw on 1/6, and that party is doubling down on that ideology, it's hard to frame them as something other than an enemy. I've never felt that way about the GOP until quite a bit into Trump's presidency, but the feeling has stuck. At some point we're beyond both civics and civility.
finite_depth 3y ago
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poulsbohemian 3y ago
You aren't wrong, but let me offer a nuanced perspective... in the absence of a party, people would congregate together anyway. For example, this is a non-partisan campaign year, and yet the people who have one set of values are all lining up behind certain city council and school board candidates, because their values align. That's the part that I think a lot of apolitical / people who feel disenfranchised from politics miss - at a local / state level, political parties are mostly just your neighbors. They aren't ideological per se, they just care about their community and want to band together with people who they believe share their common views. The existence of political parties is just a natural extension of a desire to "find your people."
- ChatGTP 3y ago
  In Japan this is what happens, there is effectively a one party rule which contains factions. Japans politics are terrible though.
  - poulsbohemian 3y ago
    Consider this - in Germany, are the Greens and the SPD really that different? In Canada, are the Liberals and New Democrats really all that different? In many countries what happens is that these slightly nuanced parties end up in coalition governments anyway. Which could be a good thing as a party can be formed around a single issue and can strongly advocate in coalition for that issue. In the US, both dominate parties are actually coalitions that would be separate parties in other countries. It isn't perfect, and these factions sometimes have serious disagreements, but within the Dems we generally believe we are stronger together. The Republican party is going through a serious reckoning between its traditional base and a more extreme wing. It won't surprise me if Democrats go through something similar in about another decade as Gen Z comes of age and wants to push their agenda faster than the traditional moderates within the party.

EA-3167 3y ago

I'm too much of a cynic to believe that this was anything, but inevitable. It's not as though countries with many parties or no parties are somehow less divided right now. And frankly when one party led to what we saw on 1/6, and that party is doubling down on that ideology, it's hard to frame them as something other than an enemy. I've never felt that way about the GOP until quite a bit into Trump's presidency, but the feeling has stuck. At some point we're beyond both civics and civility.

finite_depth 3y ago

[dead]

poulsbohemian 3y ago

You aren't wrong, but let me offer a nuanced perspective... in the absence of a party, people would congregate together anyway. For example, this is a non-partisan campaign year, and yet the people who have one set of values are all lining up behind certain city council and school board candidates, because their values align. That's the part that I think a lot of apolitical / people who feel disenfranchised from politics miss - at a local / state level, political parties are mostly just your neighbors. They aren't ideological per se, they just care about their community and want to band together with people who they believe share their common views. The existence of political parties is just a natural extension of a desire to "find your people."

ChatGTP 3y ago
In Japan this is what happens, there is effectively a one party rule which contains factions. Japans politics are terrible though.
- poulsbohemian 3y ago
  Consider this - in Germany, are the Greens and the SPD really that different? In Canada, are the Liberals and New Democrats really all that different? In many countries what happens is that these slightly nuanced parties end up in coalition governments anyway. Which could be a good thing as a party can be formed around a single issue and can strongly advocate in coalition for that issue. In the US, both dominate parties are actually coalitions that would be separate parties in other countries. It isn't perfect, and these factions sometimes have serious disagreements, but within the Dems we generally believe we are stronger together. The Republican party is going through a serious reckoning between its traditional base and a more extreme wing. It won't surprise me if Democrats go through something similar in about another decade as Gen Z comes of age and wants to push their agenda faster than the traditional moderates within the party.