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> but iPhone’s really aren’t more expensive than androids, per year. > The 5g SE (2022) is $429 iPhone absolutely are more expensive than any other phone if y

> but iPhone’s really aren’t more expensive than androids, per year. > The 5g SE (2022) is $429 iPhone absolutely are more expensive than any other phone if you care about things other than the CPU/GPU performance. The 5g SE has a tiny screen with archaic bezel design and still uses LCDs in an era where not giving you an OLED would be seen as a ripoff on the android market. It starts at 64gb of storage for this $429 (in France, it's actually 529 euros), my S20FE from a couple years ago which I bought at 400 euros on deals had 128gb. It has a very big, 120hz OLED screen and the finger print sensor works from underneath the screen. For me, and many others, the phone is primarily a content consumption device. If the CPU is good enough that I don't see stutters all the time then it's good enough. I don't need my smartphone to be a laptop in the pocket. I do need a screen that I enjoy looking at and big enough that I can use it to read ebooks. This in turns is heavily reflected in how many Apple users will splurge the big bucks to get the iPhone models that are comfortable to use despite their insane prices. Right now, the cheapest phone Apple produces with a large screen is the iPhone 14 Plus at 969 euros. There's a reason why the iPhone SE is the least popular of all Apple phones despite having far-more-than-good-enough hardware performance and longevity while being accessibly priced: it lacks what people actually wants out of their phone, Apple knows that and they keep the SE the way it is because they wouldn't want to cannibalize the sales of the expensive phones. If you look at any statistics, the SE is like a rounding error compared to the sales of the other iPhones.

BoorishBears 3y ago
See, a lot of people are excited about Android 14, but the S20FE is already on security update-only status... meanwhile the iPhone 13 of the same vintage just got a major OS upgrade. And next year, when the S20FE won't even have security updates, the 13 will get another major upgrade. And probably another after that. _ In fact, if you had bought a refurb $500 iPhone when the S20FE was announced (iPhone 11!), you'd still be getting into the new update the S20FE just missed out on. That is how absurdly abysmal Android support it: you could have gotten a 2 year older phone and actually gained an upgrade cycle. Also fun fact: the 2 year older iPhone 11 would also be faster than the S20 FE
- CalamityJohn 3y ago
  I don't disagree with the update story being still a problem with Android, but iOS users tend to blow it up to a level higher than it actually is because they don't understand how Android is segmented. You see, if Apple dropped support for your iPhone, you would never be able to ever get a browser upgrade again, since Safari's engine updates are tied to iOS itself. Android doesn't do that. Very old phones past their prime and past the security updates support will still receive the latest Chrome with latest web standards support and security fixes for itself (though it won't stop other apps from being able to, say, exploit a privilege escalation vulnerability and other things of that vein). You will continue to receive upgraded Messages etc. Many of the APIs are updated independently too from the OS, through the Play Store, and because the developer community is aware of the OS update fragmentation, they also tend to target older SDKs for compatibility. So android phones are not becoming obsolete as fast as some Apple-exclusive users seem to believe from only being informed about "android doesn't get updates". By the time my phone is truly done I will probably buy a new one because the battery will have worn out beyond my tolerance, as it always happens with these devices just as it happens on iPhones (I used to be on the iPhone camp when prices had not turned obscene, started with a 3g and ended with the 5s. No, I'm not paying $1k on a goddamn smartphone just because I prefer a bigger screen.). To remark on not being able to get 14: it's sad, but I don't really miss it. I've never used webcams in my entire life, and the other OS level features aren't particularly important. IMHO, both iOS and Android have become mature as OSes and most of what people care about is in the app ecosystem, not what comes out of the factory.
  - BoorishBears 3y ago
    I've launched AOSP devices professionally, so I understand how Android is segmented better than most... You spent way too many words trying to downplay some pretty simple facts: Android OS updates are what contain most headline features lay people recognize. GPS/Mainline cover things that are implementation details as far as they know, and don't cover the binary blobs which are the biggest reason why losing security updates in a year is going to mean the S20FE is forever an insecure device, regardless of what Mainline can deliver or what going with a custom rom does. _ Also Android is extremely far from mature, things like Project Mainline show we haven't even settled on how far Google gets to sink the closed sourced claws of their GPS into the core of it. I mean you've got Android 14 finally adding the APIs to properly support scrolling on high FPS displays. Android had 120hz displays years before Apple and somehow manages to screw up these basic cases because they have no unified product vision to speak of. Maybe Android will be "mature" once Google is done with their iOS-ization of AOSP driven by crappy vendors, but for now the updates are extremely meaningful.

BoorishBears 3y ago

See, a lot of people are excited about Android 14, but the S20FE is already on security update-only status... meanwhile the iPhone 13 of the same vintage just got a major OS upgrade. And next year, when the S20FE won't even have security updates, the 13 will get another major upgrade. And probably another after that. _ In fact, if you had bought a refurb $500 iPhone when the S20FE was announced (iPhone 11!), you'd still be getting into the new update the S20FE just missed out on. That is how absurdly abysmal Android support it: you could have gotten a 2 year older phone and actually gained an upgrade cycle. Also fun fact: the 2 year older iPhone 11 would also be faster than the S20 FE

CalamityJohn 3y ago
I don't disagree with the update story being still a problem with Android, but iOS users tend to blow it up to a level higher than it actually is because they don't understand how Android is segmented. You see, if Apple dropped support for your iPhone, you would never be able to ever get a browser upgrade again, since Safari's engine updates are tied to iOS itself. Android doesn't do that. Very old phones past their prime and past the security updates support will still receive the latest Chrome with latest web standards support and security fixes for itself (though it won't stop other apps from being able to, say, exploit a privilege escalation vulnerability and other things of that vein). You will continue to receive upgraded Messages etc. Many of the APIs are updated independently too from the OS, through the Play Store, and because the developer community is aware of the OS update fragmentation, they also tend to target older SDKs for compatibility. So android phones are not becoming obsolete as fast as some Apple-exclusive users seem to believe from only being informed about "android doesn't get updates". By the time my phone is truly done I will probably buy a new one because the battery will have worn out beyond my tolerance, as it always happens with these devices just as it happens on iPhones (I used to be on the iPhone camp when prices had not turned obscene, started with a 3g and ended with the 5s. No, I'm not paying $1k on a goddamn smartphone just because I prefer a bigger screen.). To remark on not being able to get 14: it's sad, but I don't really miss it. I've never used webcams in my entire life, and the other OS level features aren't particularly important. IMHO, both iOS and Android have become mature as OSes and most of what people care about is in the app ecosystem, not what comes out of the factory.
- BoorishBears 3y ago
  I've launched AOSP devices professionally, so I understand how Android is segmented better than most... You spent way too many words trying to downplay some pretty simple facts: Android OS updates are what contain most headline features lay people recognize. GPS/Mainline cover things that are implementation details as far as they know, and don't cover the binary blobs which are the biggest reason why losing security updates in a year is going to mean the S20FE is forever an insecure device, regardless of what Mainline can deliver or what going with a custom rom does. _ Also Android is extremely far from mature, things like Project Mainline show we haven't even settled on how far Google gets to sink the closed sourced claws of their GPS into the core of it. I mean you've got Android 14 finally adding the APIs to properly support scrolling on high FPS displays. Android had 120hz displays years before Apple and somehow manages to screw up these basic cases because they have no unified product vision to speak of. Maybe Android will be "mature" once Google is done with their iOS-ization of AOSP driven by crappy vendors, but for now the updates are extremely meaningful.