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They're stable and self-perpetuating, that doesn't make them better. There are plenty of abhorrent beliefs that also "stood the test of time".

rayiner 3y ago
I think you’ll find that for the most part beliefs that are present across religions are pro-adaptive in the economic and technological contexts in which they arise. I also think people fail to appreciate how much their own worldview reflects the religious tradition of their community. Coming from an eastern tradition, western secular humanism seems like an “ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of” Christianity.
- dctoedt 3y ago
  > I think you’ll find that for the most part beliefs that are present across religions are pro-adaptive in the economic and technological contexts in which they arise. True! But we have to remain open to the possibility that any such belief could represent a local maximum, roughly analogous to Ptolemaic astronomy or Newtonian physics: Serviceable in limited contexts but falling apart in others. > western secular humanism seems like an “ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of” Christianity. Which half of Christianity would that be? Being serious now: Christianity — the version actually preached by Y'shua of Nazareth — is simply Judaism stripped down to two specific commandments from the Hebrew Bible: Love God, love your neighbor as yourself. See the Parable of the Good Samaritan in Luke 10:25-37 ("Do this and you will live [eternally]") [0] and its counterpart in Matt. 22:34-40 ("On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets"). [1] Jesus wasn't trying to start a new religion: He wanted Jews to be better Jews, and he seems only reluctantly to have concerned himself with non-Jews. What we now think of as "Christianity" and its doctrines of the Triune God, soteriology (how "salvation" is achieved), and christology (what was the nature of Jesus): Those came later — in some cases, much later — from others, not from Jesus himself, so far as we know. [0] https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2010%3A25-37&version=NIV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2010%3A25-... [1] https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matt.+22%3A34-40&version=KJV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matt.+22%3A34-4...
somenameforme 3y ago
Thinking about the fertility crisis facing most of the world has made me rethink the foundations of a 'good' society. People who have more education, income, intelligence, and secularity are simply not reproducing in anywhere even remotely near sustainable levels. So what's going to happen? These traits will naturally be removed from society, up until the point that this trend reverses. So we will essentially be defacto empowering many of the views that you may consider undesirable. It really makes one rethink the relevance and place of sustainability. It seems that on any timescale that matters, it must be considered the most fundamentally critical value of any culture. Because in some ways society really is a sort of expanding zero-sum game. When one group declines, another group defacto rises. It's really annoying that there seems to be little to nothing in the way of a compromise between indulgent excesses driving the death of procreation on one end, and 'trust nothing but the Book' driving successful procreation on the other. There needs be some sort of a cultural medium.
- xyzzyz 3y ago
  > Because in some ways society really is a sort of expanding zero-sum game. When one group declines, another group defacto rises. Yeah, in exponential processes, the exact value of the base matters exponentially.

rayiner 3y ago

I think you’ll find that for the most part beliefs that are present across religions are pro-adaptive in the economic and technological contexts in which they arise. I also think people fail to appreciate how much their own worldview reflects the religious tradition of their community. Coming from an eastern tradition, western secular humanism seems like an “ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of” Christianity.

dctoedt 3y ago
> I think you’ll find that for the most part beliefs that are present across religions are pro-adaptive in the economic and technological contexts in which they arise. True! But we have to remain open to the possibility that any such belief could represent a local maximum, roughly analogous to Ptolemaic astronomy or Newtonian physics: Serviceable in limited contexts but falling apart in others. > western secular humanism seems like an “ad hoc, informally-specified, bug-ridden, slow implementation of half of” Christianity. Which half of Christianity would that be? Being serious now: Christianity — the version actually preached by Y'shua of Nazareth — is simply Judaism stripped down to two specific commandments from the Hebrew Bible: Love God, love your neighbor as yourself. See the Parable of the Good Samaritan in Luke 10:25-37 ("Do this and you will live [eternally]") [0] and its counterpart in Matt. 22:34-40 ("On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets"). [1] Jesus wasn't trying to start a new religion: He wanted Jews to be better Jews, and he seems only reluctantly to have concerned himself with non-Jews. What we now think of as "Christianity" and its doctrines of the Triune God, soteriology (how "salvation" is achieved), and christology (what was the nature of Jesus): Those came later — in some cases, much later — from others, not from Jesus himself, so far as we know. [0] https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2010%3A25-37&version=NIV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2010%3A25-... [1] https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matt.+22%3A34-40&version=KJV https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=matt.+22%3A34-4...

somenameforme 3y ago

Thinking about the fertility crisis facing most of the world has made me rethink the foundations of a 'good' society. People who have more education, income, intelligence, and secularity are simply not reproducing in anywhere even remotely near sustainable levels. So what's going to happen? These traits will naturally be removed from society, up until the point that this trend reverses. So we will essentially be defacto empowering many of the views that you may consider undesirable. It really makes one rethink the relevance and place of sustainability. It seems that on any timescale that matters, it must be considered the most fundamentally critical value of any culture. Because in some ways society really is a sort of expanding zero-sum game. When one group declines, another group defacto rises. It's really annoying that there seems to be little to nothing in the way of a compromise between indulgent excesses driving the death of procreation on one end, and 'trust nothing but the Book' driving successful procreation on the other. There needs be some sort of a cultural medium.

xyzzyz 3y ago
> Because in some ways society really is a sort of expanding zero-sum game. When one group declines, another group defacto rises. Yeah, in exponential processes, the exact value of the base matters exponentially.