5 ms·

I think the difference is that 3D is inherently continuous (because it is simulating a 3d space) and requires another layer of abstraction on top of the control

by proc0 3y ago

I think the difference is that 3D is inherently continuous (because it is simulating a 3d space) and requires another layer of abstraction on top of the controllers to work intuitively. 2D on the other hand is pixel based which is usually discrete (the world units are uniform in pixels), and also the character movement is 1:1 mapping on the controller. These two factors make 2D feel more responsive, and I'm guessing that once VR gets better it will close the abstraction gap and make the controller mapping (body/hand movement) 1:1.

hypertele-Xii 3y ago
Using pixel coordinates for 2D space is like sizing web elements in pixels - it's just plain wrong and will look vanishingly small on future higher-resolution monitors.
- zogrodea 3y ago
  Wasn't it common practice on older systems like, say, the SNES Sega Genesis? A design responsive to multiple resolutions wasn't really a thing back then as far as I know.
  - hypertele-Xii 3y ago
    Imagine the richness of retro gaming today if they had had the foresight to design for resolution independence. Now only a vanishingly tiny subset of the best of the best games have the financial incentive or dedicated modding community to release in high definition.
- smokel 3y ago
  It's just plain wrong from today's perspective. Back when pixel sizes were predictable, one could exploit this at all levels. Pixel artists would (and still continue to) consider every individual pixel, performing anti-aliasing by hand. Animations would be timed in relative to the (fixed) framerate, leading to optimal smoothness. Reaching this level of fluidity is only recently possible again, at the cost of vastly higher hardware requirements. Most people haven't even experienced this, because of the suboptimal period we have been in for some time now. You win some, you lose some.
- proc0 3y ago
  I was speaking a little more abstractly. For 2D, even if you use an intermediate coordinate system, the transformation between the two can be mapped 1:1 with the controller (in theory, not that you need to), because controllers are 2D in design (specifically the directional arrows and joysticks, which have 2D coordinates). I think allows for more natural responsiveness. If controllers had 3D joysticks, or eventually when VR gets better at hand motion, then 3D responsiveness will improve.

by proc0 3y ago

hypertele-Xii 3y ago

Using pixel coordinates for 2D space is like sizing web elements in pixels - it's just plain wrong and will look vanishingly small on future higher-resolution monitors.

zogrodea 3y ago
Wasn't it common practice on older systems like, say, the SNES Sega Genesis? A design responsive to multiple resolutions wasn't really a thing back then as far as I know.
- hypertele-Xii 3y ago
  Imagine the richness of retro gaming today if they had had the foresight to design for resolution independence. Now only a vanishingly tiny subset of the best of the best games have the financial incentive or dedicated modding community to release in high definition.
smokel 3y ago
It's just plain wrong from today's perspective. Back when pixel sizes were predictable, one could exploit this at all levels. Pixel artists would (and still continue to) consider every individual pixel, performing anti-aliasing by hand. Animations would be timed in relative to the (fixed) framerate, leading to optimal smoothness. Reaching this level of fluidity is only recently possible again, at the cost of vastly higher hardware requirements. Most people haven't even experienced this, because of the suboptimal period we have been in for some time now. You win some, you lose some.
proc0 3y ago
I was speaking a little more abstractly. For 2D, even if you use an intermediate coordinate system, the transformation between the two can be mapped 1:1 with the controller (in theory, not that you need to), because controllers are 2D in design (specifically the directional arrows and joysticks, which have 2D coordinates). I think allows for more natural responsiveness. If controllers had 3D joysticks, or eventually when VR gets better at hand motion, then 3D responsiveness will improve.