5 ms·

While a lot of this appears to be estimates... it's pretty wild of 30% of deaths from cardiovascular are caused by lead. Mostly in low/middle income countries.

by jopsen 3y ago

While a lot of this appears to be estimates... it's pretty wild of 30% of deaths from cardiovascular are caused by lead. Mostly in low/middle income countries. > It's items in the kitchen that are poisoning them On a positive note: This is something that can be fixed.

highwaylights 3y ago
I'd be interested to know how someone can be sure that the cookware/tableware/cutlery in their home is safe. Is this a result of far lower standards in other places or just a result of that being the region that was tested for the report (the post doesn't say, it just mentions that samples were collected from developing countries). This could very easily be a massive problem in the developed world too and you wouldn't know from the report here.
- mrob 3y ago
  Here's a study showing various levels of lead leaching into drinks from ceramic mugs found in the US: https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0049-7 https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186... Important quote: "The estimated daily dose of lead exceeded the California Maximum Allowable Dose Level of 0.5 μg per day for one of the five mugs tested." Previous HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29606600 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29606600
  - nayuki 3y ago
    I probably dodged this ceramic problem because I drink from borosilicate glass beakers. (Yes, I buy new, unused labware for cooking/drinking use.)
    - asdff 3y ago
      Are those not too fragile for daily use? A pint glass is so much thicker in comparison than a beaker.
      - nayuki 3y ago
        I'm an adult so it's fine. And it's like $10 if I break one, no big deal. Oh yeah, the beaker doubles as my metric-only measuring cup for cooking. It only has millilitre markings, no fluid ounce or cups at all.
      - arthur2e5 3y ago
        Mechanically more fragile than soda glass, but tougher to temperature shock -- admittedly not that useful for drinking, considering regular mugs also don't often break with boiling water. Good for cooking though: just check out the people mourning these real borosilicate Pyrex measuring cups. To me it's mostly about the aesthetics. I've broken one or two over five years, but they are just too charming to give up on… Light, holds plenty of liquid, and good for pouring from.
      - globular-toast 3y ago
        They use them daily in labs, why not at home. My home is closer to a lab than a pub. No drunk people or children allowed.
coding123 3y ago
How can it be fixed?
- conkeisterdoor 3y ago
  If I'm reading the GP correctly, by replacing kitchen items containing lead with alternatives that don't contain lead. That should be much easier and less expensive to do than eg, replacing lead pipes in the house or town/city that may be delivering poisoned drinking water.
  - eterps 3y ago
    Is there a way to know which alternatives don't contain lead?
lkbm 3y ago
I'm reminded of an old SSC post[0]: > See, my terrible lecture on ADHD suggested several reasons for the increasing prevalence of the disease. Of these I remember two: the spiritual desert of modern adolescence, and insufficient iron in the diet. And I remember thinking "Man, I hope it’s the iron one, because that seems a lot easier to fix." The discovery that we can dramatically reduce mortality by the relatively straightforward solution of using pots and pans that don't contain lead is a cause for excitement. Compare that to the solutions like "convince people to exercise more and eat less (or less tasty) food". We know how to make our dishes lead-free! [0] https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/10/society-is-fixed-biology-is-mutable/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/10/society-is-fixed-biolo...
- jstarfish 3y ago
  Wow. How does one develop an iron deficiency in America? Bread and breakfast cereals are fortified with it and it's in multivitamins, eggs, pasta, most meats, and even some chocolate. I get spinach and peas aren't for everyone, but how does one end up with a deficiency in iron when it's added to the trashiest of food? (We shit on it now, but maybe this is why the "food pyramid" was shaped so contrary to current sensibilities? Or maybe it's a potassium deficiency mislabeled as something else.)
  - sph 3y ago
    Women literally lose iron every few weeks, and many plants contain anti nutrients (phytic acid) that bind to metals, reducing their absorption, such as beans. In general though, I wouldn't place the blame on plants, but on the low quality, highly processed diet the average person consumes. I have ADHD, and I've noticed symptoms of low iron whenever I stray from my very low carb diet: restless legs, low energy, ADHD symptoms getting worse. Note that iron is a necessary component for the synthesis of dopamine. Given that I take amphetamine-based stimulants, which increase dopamine release as well as inhibiting reuptake, I might need a little more iron that usual.
    - jstarfish 3y ago
      > Women literally lose iron every few weeks Heh, great point. > and many plants contain anti nutrients (phytic acid) that bind to metals, reducing their absorption, such as beans. Also a good point, and will come back to it-- > I have ADHD, and I've noticed symptoms of low iron whenever I stray from my very low carb diet: restless legs, low energy, ADHD symptoms getting worse. Note that iron is a necessary component for the synthesis of dopamine. Right. You make an excellent test candidate then-- is this speculative or have you actually tested your iron levels during those times? I'd again question whether what you're feeling there might actually be a potassium/magnesium problem. You say "symptoms of low iron," and that's true in fact-- but it may only be low because you're consuming but not absorbing enough of it. I doubt you have much of an appetite. Assuming you aren't bleeding out from gunshot trauma or menses, the next time you're feeling symptoms of what you're attributing to low iron, try eating a daily banana (or take prenatal vitamins or something).
Natsu 3y ago
One problem with a lot of the studies is that the studies have a lot of confoundeing and estimates of lead's harm seem to be rising even as exposure decreases, which should make people stop and think more. But this doesn't come up that much because it is obviously bad for you, and there's generally no good reason not to avoid exposure and not many people care about precisely how bad it is for you. But it's weird that lead exposure has been dropping while the things it's supposed to cause don't seem to be decreasing in proportion to the lack of exposure.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago
  > estimates of lead's harm seem to be rising even as exposure decreases, which should make people stop and think more Is the effect size or confidence rising? The latter makes sense. We're moving from a population systematically exposed to lead (no control) to one with lead-free kids for a change.
  - Natsu 3y ago
    Effect size, at least for harm to IQ: What is the effect of 1 μg of lead on IQ? Good studies from the different research eras can be used to illustrate how lead effect sizes have changed over time. Landrigan et al. (1975) represents the Early Era. In this study, there were 46 children in the high lead group and 78 in the control group. Their respective BLLs were 48.3 and 26.9 in 1972 and 40.5 and 26.5 in 1973, and they were 8.3 and 9.3 years old, respectively. So we have a gigantic 14 μg/dL gap between these groups. The high lead group had an average IQ of 88.02 versus 92.88 for the low lead group, or a 4.86 point IQ gap, and thus a per μg effect of 0.35 IQ points. Baghurst et al. (1992) represents the Middle Era. In this study, there were 494 children who had IQ results, and they were divided into quartiles by BLLs. The mean concentrations of blood at assessment age were 6.6 μg/dL for the lowest quartile, 10.1 for the second, 13.7 for the third, and 20.0 for the final one. Their IQs were 109.6, 107.7, 102.7, and 98.7, respectively. Going from the lowest to the highest lead exposure quartiles, we have a BLL difference of 13.4 μg/dL and an IQ difference of 10.9 points. Going quartile to quartile, the effect of 1 μg of lead was 0.54 IQ points, 1.39 IQ points, and then 0.63 IQ points, with the aggregate (1 - 4) being 0.81 IQ points. Kim, Yu & Lee (2010) represents the the Modern Era. In this study, there were 302 children who were median-split by BLLs. The high BLL group had a mean BLL of 3.74 and the low BLL group had a mean of 1.92 with IQs of 106.4 and 110, respectively. These differences of 1.82 μg/dL and 3.60 IQ points mean that the per μg/dL IQ drop was 1.98 points.

by jopsen 3y ago

highwaylights 3y ago

I'd be interested to know how someone can be sure that the cookware/tableware/cutlery in their home is safe. Is this a result of far lower standards in other places or just a result of that being the region that was tested for the report (the post doesn't say, it just mentions that samples were collected from developing countries). This could very easily be a massive problem in the developed world too and you wouldn't know from the report here.

mrob 3y ago
Here's a study showing various levels of lead leaching into drinks from ceramic mugs found in the US: https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0049-7 https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186... Important quote: "The estimated daily dose of lead exceeded the California Maximum Allowable Dose Level of 0.5 μg per day for one of the five mugs tested." Previous HN discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29606600 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29606600
- nayuki 3y ago
  I probably dodged this ceramic problem because I drink from borosilicate glass beakers. (Yes, I buy new, unused labware for cooking/drinking use.)
  - asdff 3y ago
    Are those not too fragile for daily use? A pint glass is so much thicker in comparison than a beaker.
    - nayuki 3y ago
      I'm an adult so it's fine. And it's like $10 if I break one, no big deal. Oh yeah, the beaker doubles as my metric-only measuring cup for cooking. It only has millilitre markings, no fluid ounce or cups at all.
    - arthur2e5 3y ago
      Mechanically more fragile than soda glass, but tougher to temperature shock -- admittedly not that useful for drinking, considering regular mugs also don't often break with boiling water. Good for cooking though: just check out the people mourning these real borosilicate Pyrex measuring cups. To me it's mostly about the aesthetics. I've broken one or two over five years, but they are just too charming to give up on… Light, holds plenty of liquid, and good for pouring from.
    - globular-toast 3y ago
      They use them daily in labs, why not at home. My home is closer to a lab than a pub. No drunk people or children allowed.

coding123 3y ago

How can it be fixed?

conkeisterdoor 3y ago
If I'm reading the GP correctly, by replacing kitchen items containing lead with alternatives that don't contain lead. That should be much easier and less expensive to do than eg, replacing lead pipes in the house or town/city that may be delivering poisoned drinking water.
- eterps 3y ago
  Is there a way to know which alternatives don't contain lead?

lkbm 3y ago

I'm reminded of an old SSC post[0]: > See, my terrible lecture on ADHD suggested several reasons for the increasing prevalence of the disease. Of these I remember two: the spiritual desert of modern adolescence, and insufficient iron in the diet. And I remember thinking "Man, I hope it’s the iron one, because that seems a lot easier to fix." The discovery that we can dramatically reduce mortality by the relatively straightforward solution of using pots and pans that don't contain lead is a cause for excitement. Compare that to the solutions like "convince people to exercise more and eat less (or less tasty) food". We know how to make our dishes lead-free! [0] https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/10/society-is-fixed-biology-is-mutable/ https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/10/society-is-fixed-biolo...

jstarfish 3y ago
Wow. How does one develop an iron deficiency in America? Bread and breakfast cereals are fortified with it and it's in multivitamins, eggs, pasta, most meats, and even some chocolate. I get spinach and peas aren't for everyone, but how does one end up with a deficiency in iron when it's added to the trashiest of food? (We shit on it now, but maybe this is why the "food pyramid" was shaped so contrary to current sensibilities? Or maybe it's a potassium deficiency mislabeled as something else.)
- sph 3y ago
  Women literally lose iron every few weeks, and many plants contain anti nutrients (phytic acid) that bind to metals, reducing their absorption, such as beans. In general though, I wouldn't place the blame on plants, but on the low quality, highly processed diet the average person consumes. I have ADHD, and I've noticed symptoms of low iron whenever I stray from my very low carb diet: restless legs, low energy, ADHD symptoms getting worse. Note that iron is a necessary component for the synthesis of dopamine. Given that I take amphetamine-based stimulants, which increase dopamine release as well as inhibiting reuptake, I might need a little more iron that usual.
  - jstarfish 3y ago
    > Women literally lose iron every few weeks Heh, great point. > and many plants contain anti nutrients (phytic acid) that bind to metals, reducing their absorption, such as beans. Also a good point, and will come back to it-- > I have ADHD, and I've noticed symptoms of low iron whenever I stray from my very low carb diet: restless legs, low energy, ADHD symptoms getting worse. Note that iron is a necessary component for the synthesis of dopamine. Right. You make an excellent test candidate then-- is this speculative or have you actually tested your iron levels during those times? I'd again question whether what you're feeling there might actually be a potassium/magnesium problem. You say "symptoms of low iron," and that's true in fact-- but it may only be low because you're consuming but not absorbing enough of it. I doubt you have much of an appetite. Assuming you aren't bleeding out from gunshot trauma or menses, the next time you're feeling symptoms of what you're attributing to low iron, try eating a daily banana (or take prenatal vitamins or something).

Natsu 3y ago

One problem with a lot of the studies is that the studies have a lot of confoundeing and estimates of lead's harm seem to be rising even as exposure decreases, which should make people stop and think more. But this doesn't come up that much because it is obviously bad for you, and there's generally no good reason not to avoid exposure and not many people care about precisely how bad it is for you. But it's weird that lead exposure has been dropping while the things it's supposed to cause don't seem to be decreasing in proportion to the lack of exposure.

JumpCrisscross 3y ago
> estimates of lead's harm seem to be rising even as exposure decreases, which should make people stop and think more Is the effect size or confidence rising? The latter makes sense. We're moving from a population systematically exposed to lead (no control) to one with lead-free kids for a change.
- Natsu 3y ago
  Effect size, at least for harm to IQ: What is the effect of 1 μg of lead on IQ? Good studies from the different research eras can be used to illustrate how lead effect sizes have changed over time. Landrigan et al. (1975) represents the Early Era. In this study, there were 46 children in the high lead group and 78 in the control group. Their respective BLLs were 48.3 and 26.9 in 1972 and 40.5 and 26.5 in 1973, and they were 8.3 and 9.3 years old, respectively. So we have a gigantic 14 μg/dL gap between these groups. The high lead group had an average IQ of 88.02 versus 92.88 for the low lead group, or a 4.86 point IQ gap, and thus a per μg effect of 0.35 IQ points. Baghurst et al. (1992) represents the Middle Era. In this study, there were 494 children who had IQ results, and they were divided into quartiles by BLLs. The mean concentrations of blood at assessment age were 6.6 μg/dL for the lowest quartile, 10.1 for the second, 13.7 for the third, and 20.0 for the final one. Their IQs were 109.6, 107.7, 102.7, and 98.7, respectively. Going from the lowest to the highest lead exposure quartiles, we have a BLL difference of 13.4 μg/dL and an IQ difference of 10.9 points. Going quartile to quartile, the effect of 1 μg of lead was 0.54 IQ points, 1.39 IQ points, and then 0.63 IQ points, with the aggregate (1 - 4) being 0.81 IQ points. Kim, Yu & Lee (2010) represents the the Modern Era. In this study, there were 302 children who were median-split by BLLs. The high BLL group had a mean BLL of 3.74 and the low BLL group had a mean of 1.92 with IQs of 106.4 and 110, respectively. These differences of 1.82 μg/dL and 3.60 IQ points mean that the per μg/dL IQ drop was 1.98 points.