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> Human rights are a matter determined by the conscience of humans …and the laws of physics. If there is physically not enough water around to satisfy everyone

> Human rights are a matter determined by the conscience of humans …and the laws of physics. If there is physically not enough water around to satisfy everyone's needs, then no amount of agitation about ‘rights’ will change that. A true universal right is not contingent on a particular material situation.

deleted 3y ago
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soks86 3y ago
This is about uncontrolled consumption and waste. The physics are well understood. You're arguing about "true universal right" not water. This is a political issue not a philosophical one. A bit odd to claim both physics and philosophy in an argument while ignoring all that in between stuff, that's where humanity happens.
dragonwriter 3y ago
> …and the laws of physics. No, laws of physics do not determine rights. Pragmatics and rights are orthogonal. > If there is physically not enough water around to satisfy everyone's needs, then no amount of agitation about ‘rights’ will change that. This is, ironically, more relevant to property rights in water (which are usually entitlements to take a particular amount) than to any common construction of water as a human right, which rather than an entitlement to a particular quantity is fenerally constructed as a right to equitable priority in distribution of what does exist.
tzs 3y ago
All human rights are contingent on material situations, except possibly rights that are exercised entirely in your mind. The point of rights is that they are things that we have widely agreed governments will not try to stop you from doing. That doesn't mean that they have to ensure that you have the means to exercise those rights. For example in much of the world (including the US) freedom of movement is a right. If I want to travel from my home in the Pacific Northwest of the US across the country to Florida on the public roads the government cannot simply forbid me from doing so because of my freedom of movement rights. However if I can't afford transportation, or the food and lodging I would need if I tried to walk to Florida, the government does not have to provide some means for me to get to Florida that fits my budget.

deleted 3y ago

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soks86 3y ago

This is about uncontrolled consumption and waste. The physics are well understood. You're arguing about "true universal right" not water. This is a political issue not a philosophical one. A bit odd to claim both physics and philosophy in an argument while ignoring all that in between stuff, that's where humanity happens.

dragonwriter 3y ago

> …and the laws of physics. No, laws of physics do not determine rights. Pragmatics and rights are orthogonal. > If there is physically not enough water around to satisfy everyone's needs, then no amount of agitation about ‘rights’ will change that. This is, ironically, more relevant to property rights in water (which are usually entitlements to take a particular amount) than to any common construction of water as a human right, which rather than an entitlement to a particular quantity is fenerally constructed as a right to equitable priority in distribution of what does exist.

tzs 3y ago

All human rights are contingent on material situations, except possibly rights that are exercised entirely in your mind. The point of rights is that they are things that we have widely agreed governments will not try to stop you from doing. That doesn't mean that they have to ensure that you have the means to exercise those rights. For example in much of the world (including the US) freedom of movement is a right. If I want to travel from my home in the Pacific Northwest of the US across the country to Florida on the public roads the government cannot simply forbid me from doing so because of my freedom of movement rights. However if I can't afford transportation, or the food and lodging I would need if I tried to walk to Florida, the government does not have to provide some means for me to get to Florida that fits my budget.