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Cheap food prices are a very good thing. The farmers who are struggling are the ones with unsustainable business models. The answer for them is to join forces.
by dauertewigkeit 3y ago
Cheap food prices are a very good thing. The farmers who are struggling are the ones with unsustainable business models. The answer for them is to join forces. Small time farming is a not viable anymore and it benefits nobody to try to keep it going. Most of these small timers are also way outdated in their knowledge and methods.
- jfk13 3y agoThis sounds uncomfortably like a call for more of the consolidation and industrialisation of farming, in the name of efficiency, that has been devastating to our environment.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> that has been devastating to our environment Nothing inherent to economies of scale is devastating our environment. Companion planting, soil stewardship and water management each benefit from scale.
- rikketikm 3y agoIf they are applied, yes.
- actionfromafar 3y agoTrue. It’s just that so far in agriculture, economies of scale have been let loose without much governing for ecology.
- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> so far in agriculture, economies of scale have been let loose without much governing for ecology Sure. But scale isn't the problem. (Focussing on its is counterproductive. Amidst falling efficiency, no population will choose long-term ecological impact over short-term food availability.) Solve the problem directly: incentivize land owners to steward their land. Regulate where needed. Improve agricultural education.
- Timshel 3y agoNothing is quite optimistic, issues such as are linked to scale (Just 5min of some random though) : - http://encyclopedia.uia.org/en/problem/destruction-hedges-and-hedgerow-trees http://encyclopedia.uia.org/en/problem/destruction-hedges-an... - https://crops.extension.iastate.edu/encyclopedia/soil-erosion-agricultural-production-challenge https://crops.extension.iastate.edu/encyclopedia/soil-erosio... - https://sentientmedia.org/how-does-agriculture-cause-deforestation/ https://sentientmedia.org/how-does-agriculture-cause-defores... - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_pig_farming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_pig_fa... - https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/feb/11/global-salmon-farming-harming-marine-life-and-costing-billions-in-damage https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/feb/11/global-s... Edit: and if you think not just on the ecological side. The core benefice of scale is to produce more while requiring less people. Which mean lower density of people which has so many societal impacts ...
- thriftwy 3y agoYup, because we are dying to have more of these huge latifundia bathing the world in pesticides and being so large they can buy politicians by a dozen. Are you writing from 1970?
- lm28469 3y ago> The farmers who are struggling are the ones with unsustainable business models. Or the ones who don't use pesticides that kill our planet Or the ones which treat their animals decently Or the small scale farms Or ...
- JumpCrisscross 3y agoSmall-scale farming is more resource intensive than farming at scale. (Effects of pesticides are mixed.) I like small-farm produce. But it's obviously a luxury. If you're concerned about the environment, buying small-scale organic produce is counterproductive.
- lm28469 3y agoMaybe what's unsustainable isn't their business model but our way of life, that's all I'm saying, and so far everything points that way
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- JumpCrisscross 3y ago> what's unsustainable isn't their business model but our way of life What does that actually mean? (I can point to any sociecoonomic problem and solve it by accusing someone's way of life.)
- lm28469 3y agoConsuming and producing everything as fast as possible without any consideration for our well being or the future
- dauertewigkeit 3y agoThere is less oversight when it comes to pesticide usage within smaller operations. I grew up in that environment so I can tell you from first hand experience that the grandfatherly figure selling you pumpkins on the side of the road is does not shy away from using pesticides, and unlike the big operations he is not very precise with this dosage either.
- trilbyglens 3y ago"joining forces" means selling out to a corporate farm, and becoming a minimum wage laborer.
- rightbyte 3y agoFarmer cooperatives for distribution are quite common. But ye consolidation will make things worse for the farmers. I don't understand how anyone who not inherit a farm would ever consider fighting the interest rate buying one. The amount of work per dollar is insane compared to other sectors.
- noteflakes 3y ago> Cheap food prices are a very good thing. If anything, food should be more expensive. Current prices do not represent the cost of production, hence subsidies. The consequences are nefarious: farmers spending their entire career paying off debt, half of produce ending up in the trash, underpayed immigrants working in agriculture, cheap imports (subsidized by the origin country) putting pressure on local producers... Food is literally something we cannot live without. It should be valued accordingly.
- dauertewigkeit 3y agoIf that is the economist's conclusion than I'd rather kick the economist than take his advice.
- Martinussen 3y agoAre subsidies not inherently valuing something highly? Except with some safeguards to prevent "Well you're poor so why are you worth keeping alive". Maybe it's better to shift ag subsidies to things like food stamps/some form of UBI, but that would definitively be a prerequisite.
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- NotSuspicious 3y agoCheap food stabilizes the entire system. Expensive food is how you get riots.
- PH95VuimJjqBqy 3y agoI think you're spot on and it honestly amazes me how we have so much evidence of this throughout history and yet people can will still end up thinking about this purely in terms of "the free market".
- dukeyukey 3y agoExpensive food _literally_ kills civilizations. Not just cities, or countries, entire civilizations.
- pcl 3y agoWhere do you think the line is between small scale and what becomes sustainable? 10 acres? 100? 1000? Bigger?