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> he assumes that the West is doing the same Of course it is? The CIA was openly crying in the press a couple years ago about their Chinese network getting rol

by l3mure 3y ago

> he assumes that the West is doing the same Of course it is? The CIA was openly crying in the press a couple years ago about their Chinese network getting rolled up, and later touted the establishment of a "China Mission Center." https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/12/21/china-stolen-us-data-exposed-cia-operatives-spy-networks/ https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/12/21/china-stolen-us-data-ex... https://www.npr.org/2021/11/16/1051170999/as-u-s-spies-look-to-the-future-one-target-stands-out-china https://www.npr.org/2021/11/16/1051170999/as-u-s-spies-look-...

drt5b7j 3y ago
Of course the West also has spies everywhere. But it's not doing the same as China. The scale in which china does it isn't even in the same league. Edit: just skimmed your comment history. You're one of those "America bad" people. Good luck.
- klibertp 3y ago
  Argument from character - exemplified by a post history - is a fallacy. Other than that, sorry to break it to you, but "America" (the USA govt, more specifically) is really bad for almost everyone other than US citizens. Which is expected - officials routinely say they have their own citizens and industry well-being in mind. The US has had almost 40 years of monopoly in what you could call a "protection racket" if it wasn't already called a NATO charter. As a result, as with all monopolists, the price of belonging to the club was very high (both economically and politically, and in other areas, too). And that was even before Trump, when a lot of trust in stability of long-term commitments went down the drain. To many countries it's still worth it, of course. To many, though, it's just the only option, irrespective of the costs. To them, "America bad" is an obvious statement of fact. And I'm speaking about nominal "allies" here! Imagine how it looks to Iranians or Afghans. I'm not "against America", I'm against exploitative monopolies, no matter where they come from. The fact that every other option is even worse, doesn't really negate the fact that America can, and many time is, objectively "bad" news to others.

by l3mure 3y ago

drt5b7j 3y ago

Of course the West also has spies everywhere. But it's not doing the same as China. The scale in which china does it isn't even in the same league. Edit: just skimmed your comment history. You're one of those "America bad" people. Good luck.

klibertp 3y ago
Argument from character - exemplified by a post history - is a fallacy. Other than that, sorry to break it to you, but "America" (the USA govt, more specifically) is really bad for almost everyone other than US citizens. Which is expected - officials routinely say they have their own citizens and industry well-being in mind. The US has had almost 40 years of monopoly in what you could call a "protection racket" if it wasn't already called a NATO charter. As a result, as with all monopolists, the price of belonging to the club was very high (both economically and politically, and in other areas, too). And that was even before Trump, when a lot of trust in stability of long-term commitments went down the drain. To many countries it's still worth it, of course. To many, though, it's just the only option, irrespective of the costs. To them, "America bad" is an obvious statement of fact. And I'm speaking about nominal "allies" here! Imagine how it looks to Iranians or Afghans. I'm not "against America", I'm against exploitative monopolies, no matter where they come from. The fact that every other option is even worse, doesn't really negate the fact that America can, and many time is, objectively "bad" news to others.