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Another project announcement, another situation where I would literally pay a coffee's worth to cut to the chase -- why is there a need for another GitOps tool

by k8svet 3y ago

Another project announcement, another situation where I would literally pay a coffee's worth to cut to the chase -- why is there a need for another GitOps tool when several already exist? Tighter integration with other Argo products? Why is this not simple a new component of Argo CI/CD? How much is "thought-leadership" a part of it, it is Kubernetes-adjacent, after all. So far even the answers in this thread leaving me asking these questions even more strongly? If Argo CD is a "continuous deployment" tool, why isn't the priority making staged-rollouts a first class feature in Argo CD itself? This is coming from a place of curiosity, not simply being a miser, I promise.

wg0 3y ago
There's fluxcd and Argo. What other Gitops tools one should keep an eye on?
- k8svet 3y ago
  https://github.com/weaveworks/awesome-gitops https://github.com/weaveworks/awesome-gitops but also, like, a shell script? I guess, gitops + gating/staging is compelling, but again, I don't see how this is a distinct product.
therealkrancour 3y ago
Depending who you ask, CD stands for one of two things: Continuous _Deployment_ or Continuous _Delivery_ and they're not actually the same thing. Want to go camping? You go on Amazon and order a tent. An Amazon truck _delivers_ it to you. Not the same as deployment. Deployment is when you pitch the tent. Argo CD and Flux are great at Deployment. "Make this run in my cluster." Neither of them addresses the other need -- delivery -- getting artifacts from point A to point B with adequate quality gates, etc. along the way.
- edvinbesic 3y ago
  Isn’t that Argo Rollouts?
  - therealkrancour 3y ago
    That's also deployment. It's a drop-in replacement for the Kubernetes Deployment resource type. It doesn't do anything to help you get things from point A to point B.
- k8svet 3y ago
  I don't know what this means, to be honest. Everything I build ends up as a cached Nix derivation output. Delivery is a glorified http get w/ a pre-configured public key. Beyond trivial, and even more so now that the containerd-nix-snapshotter [1] is available. (This is where my shade at the k8s ecosystem comes in, there are millions of dollars in VC funds invested in Golang projects that are obliviated by just... using Nix). Though, I guess maybe I just need Kargo and not the rest of Argo? Can someone confirm that? I'm here and bothering commenting because I do still see the value of "pipelines" and gating. Just, incredibly skeptical of new K8s-related products using k8sy buzzwords. And this announcement blogpost is dripping in them. [1]: https://discourse.nixos.org/t/nix-snapshotter-native-understanding-of-nix-packages-for-containerd/32696 https://discourse.nixos.org/t/nix-snapshotter-native-underst... (aka, just deploy nix paths as native containers and you get the power of the nix + nix-store)
deleted 3y ago
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by k8svet 3y ago

wg0 3y ago

There's fluxcd and Argo. What other Gitops tools one should keep an eye on?

k8svet 3y ago
https://github.com/weaveworks/awesome-gitops https://github.com/weaveworks/awesome-gitops but also, like, a shell script? I guess, gitops + gating/staging is compelling, but again, I don't see how this is a distinct product.

therealkrancour 3y ago

Depending who you ask, CD stands for one of two things: Continuous _Deployment_ or Continuous _Delivery_ and they're not actually the same thing. Want to go camping? You go on Amazon and order a tent. An Amazon truck _delivers_ it to you. Not the same as deployment. Deployment is when you pitch the tent. Argo CD and Flux are great at Deployment. "Make this run in my cluster." Neither of them addresses the other need -- delivery -- getting artifacts from point A to point B with adequate quality gates, etc. along the way.

edvinbesic 3y ago
Isn’t that Argo Rollouts?
- therealkrancour 3y ago
  That's also deployment. It's a drop-in replacement for the Kubernetes Deployment resource type. It doesn't do anything to help you get things from point A to point B.
k8svet 3y ago
I don't know what this means, to be honest. Everything I build ends up as a cached Nix derivation output. Delivery is a glorified http get w/ a pre-configured public key. Beyond trivial, and even more so now that the containerd-nix-snapshotter [1] is available. (This is where my shade at the k8s ecosystem comes in, there are millions of dollars in VC funds invested in Golang projects that are obliviated by just... using Nix). Though, I guess maybe I just need Kargo and not the rest of Argo? Can someone confirm that? I'm here and bothering commenting because I do still see the value of "pipelines" and gating. Just, incredibly skeptical of new K8s-related products using k8sy buzzwords. And this announcement blogpost is dripping in them. [1]: https://discourse.nixos.org/t/nix-snapshotter-native-understanding-of-nix-packages-for-containerd/32696 https://discourse.nixos.org/t/nix-snapshotter-native-underst... (aka, just deploy nix paths as native containers and you get the power of the nix + nix-store)

deleted 3y ago

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