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So now we've learned what brain is not - but what is the biologically/evolutionary correct model that explains the opposite impulses that we all are dealing wit

So now we've learned what brain is not - but what is the biologically/evolutionary correct model that explains the opposite impulses that we all are dealing with? And why some of those impulses need willpower and grow weaker under the influence of stress/alcohol/drugs, while others seem to grow stronger?

sdwr 3y ago
Three-brain structure (Freud's id, ego, superego) is still the best simple explanation I know. Maybe the physical reality is a bit different, but it partitions actions so nicely. Id - base impulses, bubble up automatically and subconsciously Ego - the self, the "me". Where the story of identity comes from, what gets judged in court. Superego - rules imposed from on high that restrict behavior ----- I think "opposite impulses" can be explained as a form of self-control. Let's say I see someone I'm attracted to, but want to maintain composure and stay in a neutral stance. Left to my own devices I'll flush, and my eyes will widen, maybe I'll get clumsy. Bringing an opposite-but-aligned emotion in maintains equilibrium (anger, disgust...) I see opposite-but-aligned impulses with my dog all the time. He knows I don't like him chasing squirrels. When he sees one, he gets activated + alert, but redirects his energy into running a few paces the other way. It's a bridge between the id (Go! Chase!) and the superego (Stay calm, don't pull!)
- robertlagrant 3y ago
  I never understood why the superego isn't me.
  - arrosenberg 3y ago
    It probably makes sense to think about it as base-me and societally-influenced-me.
  - mrkeen 3y ago
    You don't need to. 'Superego' is an invention. You could invent your own abstract idea and call it you. Or you could simply declare that the superego is you.
    - robertlagrant 3y ago
      I mean in the construct of ego/id/superego, why is the "ego" me and not the "superego"?
      - sdwr 3y ago
        Superego is what you are supposed to do, id is what you want, and ego is where they meet in the middle. If you are identifying with the superego, maybe you are in a situation where you more "have to"s than "want to"s?
      - RugnirViking 3y ago
        none of them alone is you. Thats kinda the point. You are all three. Maybe you were tempted to do something indulgent, but decided against it. Another brain might have made a different choice. On a different day, with a little more stress and tiredness, you yourself might have made a different choice.
- nemo 3y ago
  Interestingly, Freud's model is very similar to Plato's tripartite soul from the Republic with the appetites, the "spirited" part of the soul, and Nous, and Aristotelian psychology has the same tripartite soul. The big difference is the modern view of superego vs the ancient view of nous are quite distinct.
csours 3y ago
The problem is that the world does not owe you simple explanations.
- ivanhoe 3y ago
  There's a huge difference between simple and simplified. The whole purpose of the science is building the (more or less always) simplified models of the world, abstracting important concepts out of the chaos of real world so that we can reason about them easier.

sdwr 3y ago

Three-brain structure (Freud's id, ego, superego) is still the best simple explanation I know. Maybe the physical reality is a bit different, but it partitions actions so nicely. Id - base impulses, bubble up automatically and subconsciously Ego - the self, the "me". Where the story of identity comes from, what gets judged in court. Superego - rules imposed from on high that restrict behavior ----- I think "opposite impulses" can be explained as a form of self-control. Let's say I see someone I'm attracted to, but want to maintain composure and stay in a neutral stance. Left to my own devices I'll flush, and my eyes will widen, maybe I'll get clumsy. Bringing an opposite-but-aligned emotion in maintains equilibrium (anger, disgust...) I see opposite-but-aligned impulses with my dog all the time. He knows I don't like him chasing squirrels. When he sees one, he gets activated + alert, but redirects his energy into running a few paces the other way. It's a bridge between the id (Go! Chase!) and the superego (Stay calm, don't pull!)

robertlagrant 3y ago
I never understood why the superego isn't me.
- arrosenberg 3y ago
  It probably makes sense to think about it as base-me and societally-influenced-me.
- mrkeen 3y ago
  You don't need to. 'Superego' is an invention. You could invent your own abstract idea and call it you. Or you could simply declare that the superego is you.
  - robertlagrant 3y ago
    I mean in the construct of ego/id/superego, why is the "ego" me and not the "superego"?
    - sdwr 3y ago
      Superego is what you are supposed to do, id is what you want, and ego is where they meet in the middle. If you are identifying with the superego, maybe you are in a situation where you more "have to"s than "want to"s?
    - RugnirViking 3y ago
      none of them alone is you. Thats kinda the point. You are all three. Maybe you were tempted to do something indulgent, but decided against it. Another brain might have made a different choice. On a different day, with a little more stress and tiredness, you yourself might have made a different choice.
nemo 3y ago
Interestingly, Freud's model is very similar to Plato's tripartite soul from the Republic with the appetites, the "spirited" part of the soul, and Nous, and Aristotelian psychology has the same tripartite soul. The big difference is the modern view of superego vs the ancient view of nous are quite distinct.

csours 3y ago

The problem is that the world does not owe you simple explanations.

ivanhoe 3y ago
There's a huge difference between simple and simplified. The whole purpose of the science is building the (more or less always) simplified models of the world, abstracting important concepts out of the chaos of real world so that we can reason about them easier.