4 ms·

I don't like this solution because it will cost me money and time to setup myself a modem that can handle properly ipv6 or switch to a more expensive provider.

by azlev 3y ago

I don't like this solution because it will cost me money and time to setup myself a modem that can handle properly ipv6 or switch to a more expensive provider. Send the bill to end users is not what should be done. All this ipv6 endeavour already cost me a lot of time learning and troubleshooting software, and sometimes realizing that some modems doesn't have a good ipv6 stack and the best solution is to turn it off.

ianburrell 3y ago
Charging for IPv4 is mostly going to affect hosting providers. Until recently, AWS users were charged nothing for public IP so there was no incentive to conserve. The price for IP for connections is already builtin to the price. Also, ISPs just use CGNAT to share IPs with multiple customers when they are short, It makes sense to charge more for static IP. How long ago did you do try IPv6? These days it should just work. If your router doesn’t work, get a better router since it is broken.
preisschild 3y ago
Blame your ISP. IPv6 should have already been supported since the 2000s.
- Tijdreiziger 3y ago
  Then there are a lot of ISPs to blame: https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html
  - Gigachad 3y ago
    By that chart, the IPv6 rollout will be basically complete by 2030. I suspect it will speed up near the end though as the first few services start to go V6 only.
    - jtriangle 3y ago
      I mean, that's nice to think about, but are you going to spin up a service that's v6 only? I sure as hell wouldn't want to be the canary in that coalmine...
      - lmm 3y ago
        I already do for hobby projects that are only for me and maybe a few friends. Why pay the extra for a v4 address?
      - Macha 3y ago
        I have a couple on my home network. Since I only have one public IPv4 address, port forwarding only allows me to expose one device on IPv4 on port 80. I could use a reverse proxy for those services, like I do for others, but as the only user who has reliable IPv6 on all my devices, there's no need.
  - Dobbs 3y ago
    That is a really nice chart, thanks for sharing. What is confusing me is the Netherlands. We only have about 13% adoption. I'm on one of the largest ISPs KPN and get 10/10 on IPv6 tests. Is this because I use a custom router? I'd expect it to be a lot higher since apparently KPN supports IPv6.
    - nerdbert 3y ago
      Ziggo has also rolled out IPv6 to all its customers so far as I know. They have about 40% of the market.
      - Tijdreiziger 3y ago
        So I decided to do a bit of research: * VodafoneZiggo has 40-45% of the home market, but also 25-30% of the business market and 20-25% of the mobile market [1]. They seem to offer IPv6 on their home and business connections, but not on their mobile connections [2, 3, 4]. * KPN (35-40% home/biz, 25-30% mobile): IPv6 for homes (except older modem types) and mobiles, but not by default for businesses [5, 6]. * Odido [ex T-Mobile] (30-35% mobile, 5-10% home/biz): no IPv6 across the board [7, 8]. * Eurofiber (20-25% biz): has IPv6 [9]. * Delta (5-10% home): no IPv6 [10]. * Unspecified smaller ISPs (0-5% home/biz, 10-15% mobile): unknown. * Finally, a number of wholesale access providers, where the customer presumably has a say in IPv6 support. This works out to 75-90% IPv6 in homes, 45-60% in businesses (ignoring wholesale) and only 35-45% for mobiles. So, the mystery is not solved, because this data still doesn’t support Google’s 13% figure… [1] https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/autoriteit.consument.en.markt/viz/Telecommonitor/OVER https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/autoriteit.consument.... [2] https://www.ziggo.nl/klantenservice/internet-wifi/ipv6-bij-ziggo https://www.ziggo.nl/klantenservice/internet-wifi/ipv6-bij-z... [3] https://community.ziggo.nl/t5/Internet/Instellen-ipv6-zakelijk-internet-pro/td-p/1144323 https://community.ziggo.nl/t5/Internet/Instellen-ipv6-zakeli... [4] https://community.vodafone.nl/t5/Archief/IPv6-op-mobiel/td-p/214463 https://community.vodafone.nl/t5/Archief/IPv6-op-mobiel/td-p... [5] https://www.kpn.com/service/internet/ipv6.htm https://www.kpn.com/service/internet/ipv6.htm [6] https://zakelijkforum.kpn.com/internet-bellen-9/ipv6-werkt-niet-13580 https://zakelijkforum.kpn.com/internet-bellen-9/ipv6-werkt-n... [7] https://community.odido.nl/bekabeld-internet-492/ipv6-wanneer-de-2021-editie-335568/index3.html https://community.odido.nl/bekabeld-internet-492/ipv6-wannee... [8] https://community.odido.nl/netwerk-en-verbinding-559/wanneer-komt-t-mobile-eens-met-ipv6-sidn-impact-eventuele-routeerbaarheid-127-0-0-0-8-reeks-is-enorm-339477 https://community.odido.nl/netwerk-en-verbinding-559/wanneer... [9] https://www.eurofiber.com/nl-nl/snel-internet https://www.eurofiber.com/nl-nl/snel-internet [10] https://www.delta.nl/klantenservice/vrije-modemkeuze/ https://www.delta.nl/klantenservice/vrije-modemkeuze/, expand ‘stap 4’
- lxgr 3y ago
  Blaming is nice, moving your business elsewhere is better. Unfortunately, not everybody has more than one ISP serving their area.

by azlev 3y ago

ianburrell 3y ago

Charging for IPv4 is mostly going to affect hosting providers. Until recently, AWS users were charged nothing for public IP so there was no incentive to conserve. The price for IP for connections is already builtin to the price. Also, ISPs just use CGNAT to share IPs with multiple customers when they are short, It makes sense to charge more for static IP. How long ago did you do try IPv6? These days it should just work. If your router doesn’t work, get a better router since it is broken.

preisschild 3y ago

Blame your ISP. IPv6 should have already been supported since the 2000s.

Tijdreiziger 3y ago
Then there are a lot of ISPs to blame: https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html
- Gigachad 3y ago
  By that chart, the IPv6 rollout will be basically complete by 2030. I suspect it will speed up near the end though as the first few services start to go V6 only.
  - jtriangle 3y ago
    I mean, that's nice to think about, but are you going to spin up a service that's v6 only? I sure as hell wouldn't want to be the canary in that coalmine...
    - lmm 3y ago
      I already do for hobby projects that are only for me and maybe a few friends. Why pay the extra for a v4 address?
    - Macha 3y ago
      I have a couple on my home network. Since I only have one public IPv4 address, port forwarding only allows me to expose one device on IPv4 on port 80. I could use a reverse proxy for those services, like I do for others, but as the only user who has reliable IPv6 on all my devices, there's no need.
- Dobbs 3y ago
  That is a really nice chart, thanks for sharing. What is confusing me is the Netherlands. We only have about 13% adoption. I'm on one of the largest ISPs KPN and get 10/10 on IPv6 tests. Is this because I use a custom router? I'd expect it to be a lot higher since apparently KPN supports IPv6.
  - nerdbert 3y ago
    Ziggo has also rolled out IPv6 to all its customers so far as I know. They have about 40% of the market.
    - Tijdreiziger 3y ago
      So I decided to do a bit of research: * VodafoneZiggo has 40-45% of the home market, but also 25-30% of the business market and 20-25% of the mobile market [1]. They seem to offer IPv6 on their home and business connections, but not on their mobile connections [2, 3, 4]. * KPN (35-40% home/biz, 25-30% mobile): IPv6 for homes (except older modem types) and mobiles, but not by default for businesses [5, 6]. * Odido [ex T-Mobile] (30-35% mobile, 5-10% home/biz): no IPv6 across the board [7, 8]. * Eurofiber (20-25% biz): has IPv6 [9]. * Delta (5-10% home): no IPv6 [10]. * Unspecified smaller ISPs (0-5% home/biz, 10-15% mobile): unknown. * Finally, a number of wholesale access providers, where the customer presumably has a say in IPv6 support. This works out to 75-90% IPv6 in homes, 45-60% in businesses (ignoring wholesale) and only 35-45% for mobiles. So, the mystery is not solved, because this data still doesn’t support Google’s 13% figure… [1] https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/autoriteit.consument.en.markt/viz/Telecommonitor/OVER https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/autoriteit.consument.... [2] https://www.ziggo.nl/klantenservice/internet-wifi/ipv6-bij-ziggo https://www.ziggo.nl/klantenservice/internet-wifi/ipv6-bij-z... [3] https://community.ziggo.nl/t5/Internet/Instellen-ipv6-zakelijk-internet-pro/td-p/1144323 https://community.ziggo.nl/t5/Internet/Instellen-ipv6-zakeli... [4] https://community.vodafone.nl/t5/Archief/IPv6-op-mobiel/td-p/214463 https://community.vodafone.nl/t5/Archief/IPv6-op-mobiel/td-p... [5] https://www.kpn.com/service/internet/ipv6.htm https://www.kpn.com/service/internet/ipv6.htm [6] https://zakelijkforum.kpn.com/internet-bellen-9/ipv6-werkt-niet-13580 https://zakelijkforum.kpn.com/internet-bellen-9/ipv6-werkt-n... [7] https://community.odido.nl/bekabeld-internet-492/ipv6-wanneer-de-2021-editie-335568/index3.html https://community.odido.nl/bekabeld-internet-492/ipv6-wannee... [8] https://community.odido.nl/netwerk-en-verbinding-559/wanneer-komt-t-mobile-eens-met-ipv6-sidn-impact-eventuele-routeerbaarheid-127-0-0-0-8-reeks-is-enorm-339477 https://community.odido.nl/netwerk-en-verbinding-559/wanneer... [9] https://www.eurofiber.com/nl-nl/snel-internet https://www.eurofiber.com/nl-nl/snel-internet [10] https://www.delta.nl/klantenservice/vrije-modemkeuze/ https://www.delta.nl/klantenservice/vrije-modemkeuze/, expand ‘stap 4’
lxgr 3y ago
Blaming is nice, moving your business elsewhere is better. Unfortunately, not everybody has more than one ISP serving their area.