6 ms·

As someone in the USA I've compared GPS to an Airtag and the difference hasn't shown to be different enough to bother with GPS. Considering how cheap an airtag

As someone in the USA I've compared GPS to an Airtag and the difference hasn't shown to be different enough to bother with GPS. Considering how cheap an airtag is and the difference in battery life - it's a no brainer to use an airtag. The density of iOS devices in the USA is such that it's very comparable to GPS in my experience. This is a cool project, though. One thing I didn't see is, how much does it cost to make this in practice?

Beached 3y ago
in rural America, airtags don't work.well. I live kn acreage, and so do all my neighbors. the odds that out cat is within Bluetooth range is slim.
solardev 3y ago
I wish Androids had a way to talk to the Airtags :/ iphones have that cool proprietary technology that points you in the direction of the Airtag even if no other phones are nearby
- LeSaucy 3y ago
  I use that feature for finding my keys and wallet at least 2-3 a week. One of the many things keeping me on an iphone.
- flax 3y ago
  That's Ultra Wide-band (UWB), and it's supported on several Android phones including Pixel 6/7 Pro. I don't know if the proprietary Apple bullshit prevents using Android to find them, but there are UWB trackers from Tile and Samsung as well.
  - hn_throwaway_99 3y ago
    > but there are UWB trackers from Tile and Samsung as well. I think the problem is that these trackers get a lot of their benefits from network effects. I own a bunch of Tiles, and I find them really useful, but if I lose my luggage somewhere I'll only get a ping if they happen to be in range of another phone that also has the Tile app. Meanwhile, with AirTags, given the prevalence of iPhones in the US, you're much likely to be in range of someone with an iPhone at most times.
    - xp84 3y ago
      100%. That’s the reason I would only buy something on the Find My network (have recently had great success with “ATUVOS” ones for about $12 each and one found on Temu for like $10ish) or maybe if there was another that would enjoy 90%+ coverage of Android phones - although I suspect the fragmentation and unavailability of system updates to many devices that aren’t brand new would mean it would take 5 years for such a network to be built.
    - BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
      I think Google is actually working on this: > In addition, Google is updating its Find My Device experience to make it easier to locate devices by ringing them or viewing their location on a map — even if they’re offline, it says. > This, too, will arrive later this summer, along with new support for Bluetooth trackers from Tile, Chipolo, and Pebblebee, as well as audio devices like Pixel Buds and headphones from Sony and JBL. https://techcrunch.com/2023/05/10/googles-find-my-device-network-to-warn-about-unknown-airtags-with-you/ https://techcrunch.com/2023/05/10/googles-find-my-device-net...
- _ea1k 3y ago
  Yeah, it is annoying that things like this aren't open standards. But that doesn't sell phones via lockin.
- up6w6 3y ago
  Check out https://github.com/seemoo-lab/openhaystack https://github.com/seemoo-lab/openhaystack
Timothycquinn 3y ago
I did a very rough BOM analysis of just the raw components and if you buy them at their highest rate (1pc cutoffs), the raw component cost excluding the PCB was about $100 USD. My guess is you would be looking at about $200. Personally, I would be jumping in if I could buy a fully populated PCB and take care of 3D printing, final assembly and software. However, doing electronics like this is far out of my wheelhouse.
- Paul-Craft 3y ago
  Thanks, this was very helpful to me. At $200 with no subscription fees, I would definitely consider one of these for my dog. :)
petsfed 3y ago
I live out in the sticks, and the whole reason I invested in a GPS/LTE collar for my dog is because there are broad swaths where he'd only be in range of an apple device if he had line-of-sight to it. Considering his favorite exploring path is the creek bed set 8 feet below grade, that means he'll just disappear. I'd love to own the data from that collar, but I also looked into the BOM of doing this, and (considering what my time is worth doing the full-stack embedded electronics thing) it was absolutely cheaper to buy it and lose access to the data. It's a lot cheaper than fully fencing 2.5 acres out in the country.
- jjtheblunt 3y ago
  > i'd love to own the data from that collar why not get him an Apple watch and put it in an exercise mode so it records GPS coords as he goes, synced to his own iCloud account?
  - xp84 3y ago
    I’m guessing the big downside to that is that an Apple Watch running a workout continuously has a battery life of maybe 6-8 hours at best, so you’d have to buy at least 2 of them and fiddle with them several times a day to swap them and start a workout. And also they cost $300 each but I haven’t looked at what any other option costs, admittedly.
  - petsfed 3y ago
    There's also the issue of keeping him on our land. There's added correction capabilities (first a signal noise, then a mild shock) as part of the Halo collar that we got him. And an entire training program that comes with it, so prior to enabling the feedback mechanisms, I train with him so its not just a bolt from the blue. He's an 80lb Belgian Malinois, a breed known for their high drive, and for being pretty scary looking. People out here keep goats, horses, chickens, etc. He knows not to go after our chickens, but do the neighbors know he won't go after theirs? The last thing I want is for him to wander onto a neighbor's property and get shot because he looks like he's helping himself to their livestock. He'll get shot for that (or less), and I'd have zero recourse, even legally. The Halo collar is the exact same price (including data plan) as the apple watch, but I trade remote feedback to him if he leaves the property (and a collar ruggedized to the rigors of an active dog), vs owning the data, but on a device that's not at all designed to be worn by a dog that likes to roll in dead fish and coyote shit. Meanwhile, adequately fencing the property (so he won't jump over it) will cost me between $12k and $30k. Compare that to $700 + $5/month.
somehnguy 3y ago
My partner runs an at-home business that results in people coming & going a bunch throughout the day - so we put AirTag collars on all 3 of our cats for peace of mind. So far none have gotten out but even in the home it's nice to just open the 'Find My' app & know exactly where cat X is when you can't seem to find them. My only hope is that in the future Apple designs an AirTag mini of sorts. Right now they're juust on the edge of being too big to keep strapped around their necks. They don't really seem to care, even at the current size, though.
r00fus 3y ago
I've thought about an AirTag for my cat, but she doesn't tolerate large collars well (meaning if she doesn't like it - it will get lost on a branch somewhere). Any way to shrink/lighten the AirTag?
jonathankoren 3y ago
So I put an AirTag on my cat, who promptly lost it in about a week. I only know very roughly where the tag is. Its location is still being updated after two years. (Lost mode activated: Sept 6, 2021. Last seen 16 minutes ago.) I used to think it was two doors down, but its somewhere near the end of the block. That's it. I have no better idea, because I have to be near it to make it beep, and I can't make it beep. The arrow mode doesn't trigger because I'm not close enough to it. Once -- and only once -- did the signal get strong enough to trigger mode, but it went away before I could do anything. AirTags kind of suck. Even when I was playing with the tag in the house, I could only get the beep/arrow mode to work when I was in the same room with it, and at that point, I could literally see it.

Beached 3y ago

in rural America, airtags don't work.well. I live kn acreage, and so do all my neighbors. the odds that out cat is within Bluetooth range is slim.

solardev 3y ago

I wish Androids had a way to talk to the Airtags :/ iphones have that cool proprietary technology that points you in the direction of the Airtag even if no other phones are nearby

LeSaucy 3y ago
I use that feature for finding my keys and wallet at least 2-3 a week. One of the many things keeping me on an iphone.
flax 3y ago
That's Ultra Wide-band (UWB), and it's supported on several Android phones including Pixel 6/7 Pro. I don't know if the proprietary Apple bullshit prevents using Android to find them, but there are UWB trackers from Tile and Samsung as well.
- hn_throwaway_99 3y ago
  > but there are UWB trackers from Tile and Samsung as well. I think the problem is that these trackers get a lot of their benefits from network effects. I own a bunch of Tiles, and I find them really useful, but if I lose my luggage somewhere I'll only get a ping if they happen to be in range of another phone that also has the Tile app. Meanwhile, with AirTags, given the prevalence of iPhones in the US, you're much likely to be in range of someone with an iPhone at most times.
  - xp84 3y ago
    100%. That’s the reason I would only buy something on the Find My network (have recently had great success with “ATUVOS” ones for about $12 each and one found on Temu for like $10ish) or maybe if there was another that would enjoy 90%+ coverage of Android phones - although I suspect the fragmentation and unavailability of system updates to many devices that aren’t brand new would mean it would take 5 years for such a network to be built.
  - BHSPitMonkey 3y ago
    I think Google is actually working on this: > In addition, Google is updating its Find My Device experience to make it easier to locate devices by ringing them or viewing their location on a map — even if they’re offline, it says. > This, too, will arrive later this summer, along with new support for Bluetooth trackers from Tile, Chipolo, and Pebblebee, as well as audio devices like Pixel Buds and headphones from Sony and JBL. https://techcrunch.com/2023/05/10/googles-find-my-device-network-to-warn-about-unknown-airtags-with-you/ https://techcrunch.com/2023/05/10/googles-find-my-device-net...
_ea1k 3y ago
Yeah, it is annoying that things like this aren't open standards. But that doesn't sell phones via lockin.
up6w6 3y ago
Check out https://github.com/seemoo-lab/openhaystack https://github.com/seemoo-lab/openhaystack

Timothycquinn 3y ago

I did a very rough BOM analysis of just the raw components and if you buy them at their highest rate (1pc cutoffs), the raw component cost excluding the PCB was about $100 USD. My guess is you would be looking at about $200. Personally, I would be jumping in if I could buy a fully populated PCB and take care of 3D printing, final assembly and software. However, doing electronics like this is far out of my wheelhouse.

Paul-Craft 3y ago
Thanks, this was very helpful to me. At $200 with no subscription fees, I would definitely consider one of these for my dog. :)

petsfed 3y ago

I live out in the sticks, and the whole reason I invested in a GPS/LTE collar for my dog is because there are broad swaths where he'd only be in range of an apple device if he had line-of-sight to it. Considering his favorite exploring path is the creek bed set 8 feet below grade, that means he'll just disappear. I'd love to own the data from that collar, but I also looked into the BOM of doing this, and (considering what my time is worth doing the full-stack embedded electronics thing) it was absolutely cheaper to buy it and lose access to the data. It's a lot cheaper than fully fencing 2.5 acres out in the country.

jjtheblunt 3y ago
> i'd love to own the data from that collar why not get him an Apple watch and put it in an exercise mode so it records GPS coords as he goes, synced to his own iCloud account?
- xp84 3y ago
  I’m guessing the big downside to that is that an Apple Watch running a workout continuously has a battery life of maybe 6-8 hours at best, so you’d have to buy at least 2 of them and fiddle with them several times a day to swap them and start a workout. And also they cost $300 each but I haven’t looked at what any other option costs, admittedly.
- petsfed 3y ago
  There's also the issue of keeping him on our land. There's added correction capabilities (first a signal noise, then a mild shock) as part of the Halo collar that we got him. And an entire training program that comes with it, so prior to enabling the feedback mechanisms, I train with him so its not just a bolt from the blue. He's an 80lb Belgian Malinois, a breed known for their high drive, and for being pretty scary looking. People out here keep goats, horses, chickens, etc. He knows not to go after our chickens, but do the neighbors know he won't go after theirs? The last thing I want is for him to wander onto a neighbor's property and get shot because he looks like he's helping himself to their livestock. He'll get shot for that (or less), and I'd have zero recourse, even legally. The Halo collar is the exact same price (including data plan) as the apple watch, but I trade remote feedback to him if he leaves the property (and a collar ruggedized to the rigors of an active dog), vs owning the data, but on a device that's not at all designed to be worn by a dog that likes to roll in dead fish and coyote shit. Meanwhile, adequately fencing the property (so he won't jump over it) will cost me between $12k and $30k. Compare that to $700 + $5/month.

somehnguy 3y ago

My partner runs an at-home business that results in people coming & going a bunch throughout the day - so we put AirTag collars on all 3 of our cats for peace of mind. So far none have gotten out but even in the home it's nice to just open the 'Find My' app & know exactly where cat X is when you can't seem to find them. My only hope is that in the future Apple designs an AirTag mini of sorts. Right now they're juust on the edge of being too big to keep strapped around their necks. They don't really seem to care, even at the current size, though.

r00fus 3y ago

I've thought about an AirTag for my cat, but she doesn't tolerate large collars well (meaning if she doesn't like it - it will get lost on a branch somewhere). Any way to shrink/lighten the AirTag?

jonathankoren 3y ago

So I put an AirTag on my cat, who promptly lost it in about a week. I only know very roughly where the tag is. Its location is still being updated after two years. (Lost mode activated: Sept 6, 2021. Last seen 16 minutes ago.) I used to think it was two doors down, but its somewhere near the end of the block. That's it. I have no better idea, because I have to be near it to make it beep, and I can't make it beep. The arrow mode doesn't trigger because I'm not close enough to it. Once -- and only once -- did the signal get strong enough to trigger mode, but it went away before I could do anything. AirTags kind of suck. Even when I was playing with the tag in the house, I could only get the beep/arrow mode to work when I was in the same room with it, and at that point, I could literally see it.