4 ms·

>I'm unsure if you understood what i was talking about. outdoor ethernet requires a crimper, otherwise you can't guarantee water-resistance. No, it does not. I

by xoa 3y ago

>I'm unsure if you understood what i was talking about. outdoor ethernet requires a crimper, otherwise you can't guarantee water-resistance. No, it does not. I'm fairly sure you do not deal with outdoor networking of any kind, or you'd be more familiar with the myriad of solutions to this. The most basic of which are feeding a terminated cable through a tight rubber gasket of some kind, which then fits around the 8P8C port in some way, and is installed facing up. That is typically plenty for outdoor survivability short of full submersion, including driving rain storms, complete coverage in snow etc. Sometimes dielectric grease or the like may be added if it's going to be buried underground too. Like, this is a solved problem, for ages. Cheap PtP devices, outdoor WAPs, outdoor switches, ethernet extenders etc all handle this just fine. All of them use preterminated cables (of course you can make your own). >the power and data are separate - unless you mean the cable going to the dish Of course I meant the cable going to the terminal (dish). I want that in at least a pro/business terminal to have an option to use SFP directly so I can have the data go direct to fiber and power be separate, which as well as allowing far more range to the router has the added advantage of eliminating any surge or induced current considerations. >I haven't tried to "dumb WAN" the starlink because it's outside the scope of my use. I don't even see the point of getting rid of the NAT at that spot, because it's still NAT upstream, and you're gunna need NAT on your network anyway, probably. I had this issue with 4g/LTE CPE, too. Once something goes CGNAT, there's no reason to use your own equipment, as it's getting a private address anyhow, and now you're approaching quadruple NAT territory. I'd politely suggest you perhaps not be quite so confident about things you don't really use or understand.

genewitch 3y ago
I'll just leave this here: https://i.imgur.com/Clz9pSu.png https://i.imgur.com/Clz9pSu.png Since you ignored pretty much everything i said for whatever reason, i'll just say it again: it may be "just fine" in places that don't have extreme humidity and temperature deltas between night and day. All i can tell you is i've installed PtP and PtMP sector antennas and "dishes", and if the power goes out for 2 nights, you're at least in for replacing some parts. It isn't "the rain" that I/we worry about. Oddly, all the starlink stuff is heavily gasketed connectors. i wonder why they don't just use USB-C like some cameras, they could even face the connectors downward! As far as my last point - i said i don't see the point since starlink is CGNAT. It's like putting a fiber cable to a cellphone for tethering. you get no benefit. In the starlink app you can turn off DHCP and put your own junk behind it if you want - that is, if you want triple or quadruple NAT.
- xoa 3y ago
  >Since you ignored pretty much everything i said for whatever reason, i'll just say it again: it may be "just fine" in places that don't have extreme humidity and temperature deltas between night and day. All i can tell you is i've installed PtP and PtMP sector antennas and "dishes", and if the power goes out for 2 nights, you're at least in for replacing some parts. What's your criteria for extreme deltas? I've had PtP/PtMP kit installed in areas that go from above 100 to 35 below zero over the course of a year, 60+ degree 24h gyrations on occasion, with heavy humidity, heavy rain, 90 mph winds, unprotected on top of buildings, mountains and in forests. None of it has had the trouble you're suggesting over the course of a decade. I've used those mikrotik extenders to join two terminated cables underground in wet earth buried for years and they're fine. I'm legitimately, honestly curious about what your environment is like, and how power going out for just a few nights, not even weeks, would mean any kind of permanent damage? Direct lightning strikes? That at least is fairly uncommon here, usually double grounding is plenty sufficient though I tend to break exterior links to core with fiber these days just in case. >As far as my last point - i said i don't see the point since starlink is CGNAT. It's like putting a fiber cable to a cellphone for tethering. you get no benefit. What? There's tons of benefit! First, Starlink, and failover cellular dedicated modems, PtMP/PtP etc, frequently would be ideally installed hundreds or more feet away from wherever the core rack and router are, which in turn are away from fanned out further switches/WAPs. And in high positions more prone to surge. Fiber breaks that link in and has effectively no range limits, while being cheap and easy to work with. What would CGNAT have to do with the tremendous limitations of their router? Say you've got a small LAN covering even just a million square feet, Starlink router won't cover that itself. What about nested traffic shaping of various kinds, supporting your 802.1x auth, or arbitrary VLANs (direct or stacked) or a million other things? How about automatic failover with another connection, or shaping, or automated VPN tunneling of given subnets? Which is indeed a trivial way to give even a residential CGNAT IPv4 a static IP, just get a basic VPS somewhere geographically appropriate for access patterns, setup Wireguard on it and then tunnel both ways. Totally transparent to clients, can use PPSK/MPSK so that even the most outdated pure wireless stuff with zero radius support can simply be given a password and it's on the right place. And second fwiw, Starlink Business does offer a publicly routable IPv4 (though not static), and each Starlink Terminal gets a /56 IPv6. And I did mention that terminal specifically didn't I? I mean, how is Starlink here any different then nearly any other classic ISP in existence going back decades? It's not like there's anything wrong with being happy with an ISP supplied default AIO combo deal, most of the population is. But it's also always been the case that sometimes there is a need for more. And for businesses that's particularly true. Starlink v1 supported that elegantly and near perfectly. Starlink v2 took that away, even for 5x more expensive business terminal. I'm just saying that's unfortunate, clearly unnecessary, and I hope they change course with a v3 or v4 or the like someday. Even if only on the high end one.

by xoa 3y ago

genewitch 3y ago

I'll just leave this here: https://i.imgur.com/Clz9pSu.png https://i.imgur.com/Clz9pSu.png Since you ignored pretty much everything i said for whatever reason, i'll just say it again: it may be "just fine" in places that don't have extreme humidity and temperature deltas between night and day. All i can tell you is i've installed PtP and PtMP sector antennas and "dishes", and if the power goes out for 2 nights, you're at least in for replacing some parts. It isn't "the rain" that I/we worry about. Oddly, all the starlink stuff is heavily gasketed connectors. i wonder why they don't just use USB-C like some cameras, they could even face the connectors downward! As far as my last point - i said i don't see the point since starlink is CGNAT. It's like putting a fiber cable to a cellphone for tethering. you get no benefit. In the starlink app you can turn off DHCP and put your own junk behind it if you want - that is, if you want triple or quadruple NAT.

xoa 3y ago
>Since you ignored pretty much everything i said for whatever reason, i'll just say it again: it may be "just fine" in places that don't have extreme humidity and temperature deltas between night and day. All i can tell you is i've installed PtP and PtMP sector antennas and "dishes", and if the power goes out for 2 nights, you're at least in for replacing some parts. What's your criteria for extreme deltas? I've had PtP/PtMP kit installed in areas that go from above 100 to 35 below zero over the course of a year, 60+ degree 24h gyrations on occasion, with heavy humidity, heavy rain, 90 mph winds, unprotected on top of buildings, mountains and in forests. None of it has had the trouble you're suggesting over the course of a decade. I've used those mikrotik extenders to join two terminated cables underground in wet earth buried for years and they're fine. I'm legitimately, honestly curious about what your environment is like, and how power going out for just a few nights, not even weeks, would mean any kind of permanent damage? Direct lightning strikes? That at least is fairly uncommon here, usually double grounding is plenty sufficient though I tend to break exterior links to core with fiber these days just in case. >As far as my last point - i said i don't see the point since starlink is CGNAT. It's like putting a fiber cable to a cellphone for tethering. you get no benefit. What? There's tons of benefit! First, Starlink, and failover cellular dedicated modems, PtMP/PtP etc, frequently would be ideally installed hundreds or more feet away from wherever the core rack and router are, which in turn are away from fanned out further switches/WAPs. And in high positions more prone to surge. Fiber breaks that link in and has effectively no range limits, while being cheap and easy to work with. What would CGNAT have to do with the tremendous limitations of their router? Say you've got a small LAN covering even just a million square feet, Starlink router won't cover that itself. What about nested traffic shaping of various kinds, supporting your 802.1x auth, or arbitrary VLANs (direct or stacked) or a million other things? How about automatic failover with another connection, or shaping, or automated VPN tunneling of given subnets? Which is indeed a trivial way to give even a residential CGNAT IPv4 a static IP, just get a basic VPS somewhere geographically appropriate for access patterns, setup Wireguard on it and then tunnel both ways. Totally transparent to clients, can use PPSK/MPSK so that even the most outdated pure wireless stuff with zero radius support can simply be given a password and it's on the right place. And second fwiw, Starlink Business does offer a publicly routable IPv4 (though not static), and each Starlink Terminal gets a /56 IPv6. And I did mention that terminal specifically didn't I? I mean, how is Starlink here any different then nearly any other classic ISP in existence going back decades? It's not like there's anything wrong with being happy with an ISP supplied default AIO combo deal, most of the population is. But it's also always been the case that sometimes there is a need for more. And for businesses that's particularly true. Starlink v1 supported that elegantly and near perfectly. Starlink v2 took that away, even for 5x more expensive business terminal. I'm just saying that's unfortunate, clearly unnecessary, and I hope they change course with a v3 or v4 or the like someday. Even if only on the high end one.