6 ms·

Unity wants 108% of our gross revenue

101 points by seventhtiger 3y ago

_chu1 3y ago
As a gamer, games in Unity run like smoldering hot garbage on my brand new AMD AM5 build so hopefully this gets people off of it. Valve needs to hurry up and get Source 2 out there.
- opan 3y ago
  Yeah, Unity games seem to famously not run well, and many gamers I know are turned off by hearing a game was made with it. I think we'll see Godot rise in popularity as well.
- bitwize 3y ago
  The first time I tried playing a Unity smartphone game, it made my phone hot. Again, that cemented my decision to just use the Android APIs when writing my own game.
- hightrix 3y ago
  > Unity run like smoldering hot garbage on my brand new AMD AM5 build This is actually a big problem with games made with Unity. The cheapest license requires you to show the Unity splash screen. The next license up (Pro) allows you to remove this splash screen. As you can imagine, devs using the cheapest license also tend to be lower skilled or new devs and make heavy use of the asset store's free assets. The result is that when you see the Unity splash screen you are likely playing a poorly made game. And when you are playing a Unity game that is made by a professional game studio, you don't know you are playing a Unity game. This isn't to say all devs using the personal license write bad software, but they do tend to correlate.
bitwize 3y ago
Unity is up to some Oracle-tier bullshit with their pricing model. I guess they figured the market for their stuff was well saturated and it's time to enshittify if they want to meet their shareholders' growth expectations. This makes me SO glad I decided to write games without use of a commercial engine.
- marcoberi 3y ago
  What do you use?
  - bitwize 3y ago
    Whatever APIs are available. On Android I use the Android APIs, on desktop I use SDL. Been meaning to give Raylib a look as well.
lrae 3y ago
Can somebody explain their numbers to me? That person claims 100M installs/downloads a year with 1M revenue? By install numbers that would be a top 10 mobile game? E.g., according to a quick google search, a FIFA Mobile and a Garena Free Fire has about the same amount of downloads in 2022. (Both in the top 10.)
- anonymousab 3y ago
  I'm not sure if this developer is drawing the same distinction, but Unity seems to count updates to the game on app stores as a new install for those users, as well as things like initiating the web version of a game. So if you have a few million downloads and you push out even a token update a week, I can see the numbers getting that high - at least as far as Unity is concerned. Or rather, Unity's initial Q&A responses said that. They've half-backtracked and started muddying the waters so I think they actually just didn't think it through at all.
  - gcr 3y ago
    Wait wait wait — you’re saying that at first the rule was written so every time someone visits a webpage with the Unity Web Player on it, that visit may cost the dev $0.01-$0.20 USD?!
    - seventhtiger 3y ago
      Yes they specifically confirmed that the web player is included and works the same.
      - p1necone 3y ago
        This whole thing is such a completely nonsensical shitshow that I would be surprised if Unity the company even lasts long enough to enact this policy, what the hell is going on there?
- HDMI_Cable 3y ago
  Perhaps they have multiple games? "Our studio focuses in mobile games [emphasis mine] for kids".
wlindley 3y ago
This is why some of us have been saying, for decades, only to use free software. And to base business models on actual services, not the sale of what can be infinitely and effortlessly copied. To the developers: You signed a contract, and now you expect to not have to live up to it? And equally to users: Why are you using a broken toy computer not under your control that effectively acts only to hurt you? Euphemistically calling it a "telephone" does not hide the fact you are in an abusive relationship with Microsoft/Apple/Google/Amazon (the 'evil MAGA'). Throw those gadgets away, stop hurting yourself.
- Crosseye_Jack 3y ago
  > Why are you using a broken toy computer not under your control that effectively acts only to hurt you? Euphemistically calling it a "telephone" does not hide the fact you are in an abusive relationship with Microsoft/Apple/Google/Amazon (the 'evil MAGA'). Throw those gadgets away, stop hurting yourself. Because most users are not looking for a device that is a full blown computer they can fully control. The toy computer they have in their pocket is good enough for them. Heck I'm a dev & power user and the toy computer of a phone I use as my daily driver is good enough for me when I'm chilling on the sofa/lying in bed/out with friends and I just want to query something and I just want/need an "internet consumption device" as I still have my laptop/desktop when I need a full blown computer.
  - SAI_Peregrinus 3y ago
    A key realization is that people don't buy computers (and phones) to run operating systems, or to run software. They buy computers to accomplish tasks. The software isn't what matters, completing the task in the manner they expect is.
  - freedomben 3y ago
    Nothing you said seems incompatible with an open device. Apple could open/unlock your device tomorrow and it wouldn't change a single thing you said.
    - 3y ago
ChrisArchitect 3y ago
[dupe]
- ChrisArchitect 3y ago
  Lots of discussion on the official post over here earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37481344 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37481344
  - ChrisArchitect 3y ago
    And this related post: The Death of Unity https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37486431 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37486431
qwytw 3y ago
This is so funny/bizarre... they make $8k over 1 million. Which means that with 100 mil installs they have to give Unity their entire revenue even at 1 cent per install. BUT if they actually only made $999k they wouldn't actually have to pay anything at all. I assume it's a fringe case but it's still staggering how little thought Unity's upper management put into this massive decision.
- matrix_overload 3y ago
  This is probably an intentional move by Unity. Low revenue per install is typically a sign of adware/malware or trashy fad products ("punch %POLITICIAN% in the face" kind games). It makes sense why they would not want their engine to be associated with such titles.
  - qwytw 3y ago
    Probably true, considering the new revenue limits are per game (and not company) I'd be surprised if there are necessarily that many games like this which make over 1 million. However looking at how they announced this and how they seemingly weren't even able to clearly explain how this whole thing is even supposed to work (what's an "install", who pays for Gamepass/Apple Arcade/etc. installs etc.) in the initial post, I'm still not certain that was intentional.
ignorethefacts 3y ago
[dead]
gumballindie 3y ago
Unity's announcement has got to be the dumbest move made by a commercial entity ever in the history of commercial entities. They've just destroyed their business and countless other people's businesses with that one simple trick.

101 points by seventhtiger 3y ago

As a gamer, games in Unity run like smoldering hot garbage on my brand new AMD AM5 build so hopefully this gets people off of it. Valve needs to hurry up and get Source 2 out there.

opan 3y ago
Yeah, Unity games seem to famously not run well, and many gamers I know are turned off by hearing a game was made with it. I think we'll see Godot rise in popularity as well.
bitwize 3y ago
The first time I tried playing a Unity smartphone game, it made my phone hot. Again, that cemented my decision to just use the Android APIs when writing my own game.
hightrix 3y ago
> Unity run like smoldering hot garbage on my brand new AMD AM5 build This is actually a big problem with games made with Unity. The cheapest license requires you to show the Unity splash screen. The next license up (Pro) allows you to remove this splash screen. As you can imagine, devs using the cheapest license also tend to be lower skilled or new devs and make heavy use of the asset store's free assets. The result is that when you see the Unity splash screen you are likely playing a poorly made game. And when you are playing a Unity game that is made by a professional game studio, you don't know you are playing a Unity game. This isn't to say all devs using the personal license write bad software, but they do tend to correlate.

bitwize 3y ago

Unity is up to some Oracle-tier bullshit with their pricing model. I guess they figured the market for their stuff was well saturated and it's time to enshittify if they want to meet their shareholders' growth expectations. This makes me SO glad I decided to write games without use of a commercial engine.

marcoberi 3y ago
What do you use?
- bitwize 3y ago
  Whatever APIs are available. On Android I use the Android APIs, on desktop I use SDL. Been meaning to give Raylib a look as well.

lrae 3y ago

Can somebody explain their numbers to me? That person claims 100M installs/downloads a year with 1M revenue? By install numbers that would be a top 10 mobile game? E.g., according to a quick google search, a FIFA Mobile and a Garena Free Fire has about the same amount of downloads in 2022. (Both in the top 10.)

anonymousab 3y ago
I'm not sure if this developer is drawing the same distinction, but Unity seems to count updates to the game on app stores as a new install for those users, as well as things like initiating the web version of a game. So if you have a few million downloads and you push out even a token update a week, I can see the numbers getting that high - at least as far as Unity is concerned. Or rather, Unity's initial Q&A responses said that. They've half-backtracked and started muddying the waters so I think they actually just didn't think it through at all.
- gcr 3y ago
  Wait wait wait — you’re saying that at first the rule was written so every time someone visits a webpage with the Unity Web Player on it, that visit may cost the dev $0.01-$0.20 USD?!
  - seventhtiger 3y ago
    Yes they specifically confirmed that the web player is included and works the same.
    - p1necone 3y ago
      This whole thing is such a completely nonsensical shitshow that I would be surprised if Unity the company even lasts long enough to enact this policy, what the hell is going on there?
HDMI_Cable 3y ago
Perhaps they have multiple games? "Our studio focuses in mobile games [emphasis mine] for kids".

wlindley 3y ago

This is why some of us have been saying, for decades, only to use free software. And to base business models on actual services, not the sale of what can be infinitely and effortlessly copied. To the developers: You signed a contract, and now you expect to not have to live up to it? And equally to users: Why are you using a broken toy computer not under your control that effectively acts only to hurt you? Euphemistically calling it a "telephone" does not hide the fact you are in an abusive relationship with Microsoft/Apple/Google/Amazon (the 'evil MAGA'). Throw those gadgets away, stop hurting yourself.

Crosseye_Jack 3y ago
> Why are you using a broken toy computer not under your control that effectively acts only to hurt you? Euphemistically calling it a "telephone" does not hide the fact you are in an abusive relationship with Microsoft/Apple/Google/Amazon (the 'evil MAGA'). Throw those gadgets away, stop hurting yourself. Because most users are not looking for a device that is a full blown computer they can fully control. The toy computer they have in their pocket is good enough for them. Heck I'm a dev & power user and the toy computer of a phone I use as my daily driver is good enough for me when I'm chilling on the sofa/lying in bed/out with friends and I just want to query something and I just want/need an "internet consumption device" as I still have my laptop/desktop when I need a full blown computer.
- SAI_Peregrinus 3y ago
  A key realization is that people don't buy computers (and phones) to run operating systems, or to run software. They buy computers to accomplish tasks. The software isn't what matters, completing the task in the manner they expect is.
- freedomben 3y ago
  Nothing you said seems incompatible with an open device. Apple could open/unlock your device tomorrow and it wouldn't change a single thing you said.
  - 3y ago

ChrisArchitect 3y ago

[dupe]

ChrisArchitect 3y ago
Lots of discussion on the official post over here earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37481344 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37481344
- ChrisArchitect 3y ago
  And this related post: The Death of Unity https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37486431 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37486431

qwytw 3y ago

This is so funny/bizarre... they make $8k over 1 million. Which means that with 100 mil installs they have to give Unity their entire revenue even at 1 cent per install. BUT if they actually only made $999k they wouldn't actually have to pay anything at all. I assume it's a fringe case but it's still staggering how little thought Unity's upper management put into this massive decision.

matrix_overload 3y ago
This is probably an intentional move by Unity. Low revenue per install is typically a sign of adware/malware or trashy fad products ("punch %POLITICIAN% in the face" kind games). It makes sense why they would not want their engine to be associated with such titles.
- qwytw 3y ago
  Probably true, considering the new revenue limits are per game (and not company) I'd be surprised if there are necessarily that many games like this which make over 1 million. However looking at how they announced this and how they seemingly weren't even able to clearly explain how this whole thing is even supposed to work (what's an "install", who pays for Gamepass/Apple Arcade/etc. installs etc.) in the initial post, I'm still not certain that was intentional.

ignorethefacts 3y ago

[dead]

gumballindie 3y ago

Unity's announcement has got to be the dumbest move made by a commercial entity ever in the history of commercial entities. They've just destroyed their business and countless other people's businesses with that one simple trick.