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I think there are several Differentiations that need to be talked about. For me, living in in Germany, actually, it's pretty difficult to become homeless. One

I think there are several Differentiations that need to be talked about. For me, living in in Germany, actually, it's pretty difficult to become homeless. One needs to want to be homeless, to become a true homeless. As in general, we have a social net in here. Each one can apply to get Burgergeld (Money for citizens). We're paying the rent and the costs for heating and so on.. so, a homeless is a homeless, because of pride or other reasons. If it happens that one loses his job, can't pay the bills and the monthly rent - one can apply for the money. Also, there are shelters and food stations for the homeless.. so, actually, If you don't want to be homeless, you'll get the help. On the other side, we still have homeless living on the street. Being ill and dirty. I talked to some random guy, he told me, that he actually want to live on the street. Another guy hast some mental problems and can't use money. In the end he spends all the money for weed and alcohol in the first two days after receiving. So, we have homeless who went homeless because of the personal life situations. This guys should get all the money they need to build a new life. All the others should get material help, like place to live, educational things and so on... Yes, it's cruel to say "you get money, you not" - but I don't see a way for the one's who don't want help, that they actually can pull themselves up

CSSer 3y ago
Although it’s fair to say our social net needs patching, I find it interesting that I’ve made similar observations in some places here in the United States, especially in places with robust assistance. You might find our history on mental institutions interesting if you’re unfamiliar. They were billed as a solution to the group you describe, and they were initially very popular and widely supported politically. Unfortunately, most people know the rest of the story. The system was rife with abuse and cruelty. I think it left a terrible mark on the idea that we could help such people effectively.
- NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
  > The system was rife with abuse and cruelty. As I pointed out in an earlier thread, the prevailing opinion seems to be that the institutions were the source of abuse and cruelty, and that if we could only separate the providers and treatments from the institutions, then we would be magically wonderfully free of future abuse and cruelty. Is it any wonder that that hasn't exactly panned out? Now our mental institutions are simply borderless and invisible. There's nothing new under the sun.
- P_I_Staker 3y ago
  The system is still rife with abuse and cruelty. All the same problems are still there. Mental health workers (not just the doctor) can do whatever they want to the patients, with impunity. It's a driver of wrongful incarceration and abuse. As like with other issues not everyone is terrible, but there's also abusive people that would never hit anyone, or lie to hurt them. Their abuse is softer, but much more prevalent. For every cop that murders someone there's thousands that throw someone into a wall, prevent them from going to the bathroom, or put the cuffs on tight. There's also the prevalence of crackpot treatments, albeit with some research behind them. People with ADHD are routinely given medicine that simply doesn't work, sometimes after decades of successful treatment. They will also give you medication that's dangerous not to take, even though you will struggle to get and take your medicine due to the condition. That's just the tip of the iceberg and what I know about. I'm sure there's much more.
squigz 3y ago
I read a comment just yesterday on HN talking about the social safety nets in Germany, and how one barrier for the few homeless people remaining is the bureaucracy involved (however minimal) to enrolling in those systems. So I'm not sure it's always the personal fault of those people
WeylandYutani 3y ago
In the Netherlands a significant portion of homeless are foreign citizens. The safety net purposely excludes them because otherwise you get half of Romania moving here.
- xssi 3y ago
  [flagged]
- FirmwareBurner 3y ago
  >because otherwise you get half of Romania moving here That was uncalled for. You could have easily made the same point without generalizing a whole nation.

CSSer 3y ago

Although it’s fair to say our social net needs patching, I find it interesting that I’ve made similar observations in some places here in the United States, especially in places with robust assistance. You might find our history on mental institutions interesting if you’re unfamiliar. They were billed as a solution to the group you describe, and they were initially very popular and widely supported politically. Unfortunately, most people know the rest of the story. The system was rife with abuse and cruelty. I think it left a terrible mark on the idea that we could help such people effectively.

NoZebra120vClip 3y ago
> The system was rife with abuse and cruelty. As I pointed out in an earlier thread, the prevailing opinion seems to be that the institutions were the source of abuse and cruelty, and that if we could only separate the providers and treatments from the institutions, then we would be magically wonderfully free of future abuse and cruelty. Is it any wonder that that hasn't exactly panned out? Now our mental institutions are simply borderless and invisible. There's nothing new under the sun.
P_I_Staker 3y ago
The system is still rife with abuse and cruelty. All the same problems are still there. Mental health workers (not just the doctor) can do whatever they want to the patients, with impunity. It's a driver of wrongful incarceration and abuse. As like with other issues not everyone is terrible, but there's also abusive people that would never hit anyone, or lie to hurt them. Their abuse is softer, but much more prevalent. For every cop that murders someone there's thousands that throw someone into a wall, prevent them from going to the bathroom, or put the cuffs on tight. There's also the prevalence of crackpot treatments, albeit with some research behind them. People with ADHD are routinely given medicine that simply doesn't work, sometimes after decades of successful treatment. They will also give you medication that's dangerous not to take, even though you will struggle to get and take your medicine due to the condition. That's just the tip of the iceberg and what I know about. I'm sure there's much more.

squigz 3y ago

I read a comment just yesterday on HN talking about the social safety nets in Germany, and how one barrier for the few homeless people remaining is the bureaucracy involved (however minimal) to enrolling in those systems. So I'm not sure it's always the personal fault of those people

WeylandYutani 3y ago

In the Netherlands a significant portion of homeless are foreign citizens. The safety net purposely excludes them because otherwise you get half of Romania moving here.

xssi 3y ago
[flagged]
FirmwareBurner 3y ago
>because otherwise you get half of Romania moving here That was uncalled for. You could have easily made the same point without generalizing a whole nation.