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Car size should be regulated and a maximum should be enforced. Pavement parking (and other antisocial forms of parking) should also be banned. In the UK, local
by yrro 3y ago
Car size should be regulated and a maximum should be enforced. Pavement parking (and other antisocial forms of parking) should also be banned.
In the UK, local authorities are in charge of parking enforcement. In Oxford they largely don't bother: I see vehicles parked on yellow lines every day. I can't fathom why, this is an opportunity to raise revenue!
- Pet_Ant 3y agoAn article shared recently said that road damage is weight^4. Make a car tax based on vehicle weight and the market takes care of itself. For the right classes (such as wheelchair accessible) it can be a tax write-off.
- Angostura 3y agoUK car tax is currently based on vehicle type- but it's based on CO2 emissions https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-tax-rate-tables https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-tax-rate-tables typically this is related to weight/size - except in the case of electric vehicles which are heavier than their ICE counterparts
- rob74 3y agoThis (and tax subsidies) is the reason behind the proliferation of large plug-in-hybrid SUVs - being a plug-in hybrid lowers CO2 emissions (at least on paper), but in practice many/most owners will never actually charge the car, so the CO2 emissions will be even more unrealistic than they already are.
- Pet_Ant 3y agoThis doesn’t address needlessly large EVs that damage roads and are a threat to pedestrians and bicyclists. These larger EVs are also inefficient use of battery cells than they’d be in smaller vehicles. Would love to see more Mini/Smart car EVs
- mytailorisrich 3y agoA Tesla is heavier than a petrol Range Rover. All EVs are heavy.
- wcoenen 3y agoThe weight difference of comparable ICE cars and EVs is sometimes surprisingly small when you look at the variant of the EV model with the smaller battery. For example, the BMW X3 is 1670 kg. The Tesla Model Y (SR RWD) is 1778 kg.
- oblio 3y agoThat's only for big cars. The smallest Tesla is a D-segment car, cars around 4.7m: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-segment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-segment There are 3 different car categories smaller than the smallest Tesla. For smaller cars, EVs are a mess, they're between 25 and 40% heavier than equivalent ICEs, that's a humongous difference.
- oblio 3y agoWell, they did say this: > Would love to see more Mini/Smart car EVs Teslas are big cars: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-segment https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D-segment, they're not Minis. The smallest Tesla is 4.7m long. There are 3 car categories smaller than the smaller Tesla. But yeah, EVs are heavy.
- Pet_Ant 3y agoThe larger an EV is the less efficient it is because it has to carry the unloaded battery with it, and it needs more battery for the same function. I don't have the number but I would bet that the energy need is a square of the vehicle weight. It's the same problem rockets have where they have to expend fuel just to carry fuel.
- sofixa 3y ago> Would love to see more Mini/Smart car EVs The Renault Zoe was a best seller in some countries because it's a great city car. Sadly Renault have cut back production due to diminishing margins due to supply chain issues (official version), which is a shame. There's also the Fiat 500 EV.
- jakub_g 3y agoAlso, there was an article recently that (at least in US) the CO2 emission norms are not absolute but relative to car size; to the absurd point that to fit into the norms, it's easier to make the car bigger, rather than to lower the emissions of a smaller car. Hence, SUVs.
- Angostura 3y agoAbsolute in the UK
- Angostura 3y agoI'm not sure I have seen many large plug-in hybrids on UK roads
- cjrp 3y agoSeeing more Volvo SUV PHEVs recently, big ones too.
- fomine3 3y agoPHEV shouldn't be sold to who don't have slow charging equipment at home. It's one of the best solution with home charger.
- yrro 3y agoLarger vehicles makes less efficient use of precious space. Vehicle size needs to be addressed as well as weight.
- danw1979 3y agoThis is a great idea and would handily deal with the escalating “momentum war” between selfish drivers who buy the biggest, heaviest vehicle they can afford in order to be safer than their counterparts in a collision. I’d propose we make the tax highly non-linear too…
- mytailorisrich 3y agoAs a friend od mine recently discovered, Range Rovers have an airbag under the bonnet that pops up in case of frontal collision, presumably to protect pedestrians. They hit a deer on a country road and that airbag caused £6,000 of damage to the car... Who's laughing now? ;)
- melx 3y agoI hope the deer had survived the encounter.
- odiroot 3y agoYou're right on the money. I've heard it a few times from my associates (in UK), who don't feel comfortable driving. They want to go for the big car so they can be safe. But what about other road users? You can also notice how pushy all these Range Rover drivers are on our very narrow roads.
- JambalayaJim 3y agoSafety is a reason why many people claim to purchase these cars but frankly I’m not convinced. These cars are comfortable and luxurious - appealing to safety is a way to tell themselves their purchase is practical and not frivolous. In any case I agree; these vehicles do not in fact make us more safe, overall.
- rsynnott 3y agoFrance is doing this (albeit with a carveout for electric cars).
- JambalayaJim 3y agoIt’s my understanding that personal vehicles are irrelevant compared to large trucks for this very reason. Where even the most innocuous residential street will have a garbage truck that damages the road far more than cars do. Not that their aren’t many more problems with large cars in terms of pedestrian safety, congestion, waste of parking space, etc.
- mocopoco 3y agoYes let the rich have the big cars, us peasants will kneel to the taxes as always...
- Pet_Ant 3y agoI mean, I'd rather no one have large cars and the need by addressed by business but that opens up loop-holes and other abuses. For those who are truly waste, let's at least get some other money for other uses. Both McMansions and pavement-boats are grostesque excesses... but policing morality never ends well so taxes are the gentler stick.
- mytailorisrich 3y agoParking issues are caused by number of vehicles on the road and lack of planning. Many roads in the UK are very narrow with narrow pavements: There is no space to 'properly' park even if all cars are small-ish. I have rarely seen roads with parked cars blocking half the road in Europe (at least in France) whereas this is common here in the UK.
- secretsatan 3y agoI'm not sure narrow roads in old cities are due to lack of planning, they didn't have crystal balls
- arethuza 3y agoAnd some of the "planning" that was done to make our cities car friendly was absolutely horrific - look at what someone thought was a good idea for Edinburgh: https://www.gcat.org.uk/blog/?p=682 https://www.gcat.org.uk/blog/?p=682 Edit: thankfully never built!
- yrro 3y agoSee Glascow's M8 which did get built!
- mytailorisrich 3y agoNarrow roads are not only found in old cities... They are everywhere.
- secretsatan 3y agoBut still for historical reasons, towns, villages, country lanes have been around far longer than cars
- citrin_ru 3y agoWhen most roads/streets are narrow it makes it acceptable to plan new ones narrow too. I live in a neighbourhood built in a green (farm) field in 1990s - residential street are wide enough for two compact cars to pass each other but nowadays half of the street used for parking (for lack of better places).
- moomin 3y agoSeems a good time to drag up this ad that demonstrated how much space cars take up again: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYn8aQIpNH4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYn8aQIpNH4
- austinjp 3y agoWow, I watched that with the sound off and was surprised it's actually a car manufacturer's ad. What a misfire. In turn, that reminded me of this legendary ad misfire: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strand_(cigarette)#Marketing https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strand_(cigarette)#Marketing
- tonyedgecombe 3y agoThis Fiat advert from the seventies is remarkably honest: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/22/8e/70/228e700a28f190746ea9cc95388cb117.png https://i.pinimg.com/originals/22/8e/70/228e700a28f190746ea9...
- gertrunde 3y agoThe article does discuss one of the main causes - safety. If you require various crumple/impact zones for safety reasons, which are usually all about controlling the impact deceleration over a longer period of time, i.e. less g-force on the occupants etc, then the relevant car parts get larger. Doors get thicker, front and back get extended etc. I suspect it would be quite difficult to walk back those changes, so it may be better to roll with them a little, and dictate better minimum sizes for car parking spaces. (Which might dovetail quite nicely with the increased weight of electric cars - which apparently causes issues with multi-storey parking structures which are designed around lighter cars, and may not be structurally safe if filled to capacity with vehicles 50-100% heavier than expected). (Not counting the truly ludicrous outliers - like the mentioned EV Hummer and Rolls Royce etc).
- DrScientist 3y agoYou can get an older reasonably sized car which has an NCAP rating of 5. Note bigger cars will have more mass and thus momentum & energy to dissipate, might be less nimble and certainly in the early days of SUV types were easier to roll.
- therealchiggs 3y agoIt's worth noting that NCAP ratings aren't necessarily comparable over time. New tests are periodically introduced and they generally become more stringent[1]. A 5-star car from 2015 is likely to be significantly less safe than a 5-star car from 2023. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro_NCAP#Rating_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro_NCAP#Rating_history
- DrScientist 3y agoFair point.
- yrro 3y agoE = 1/2 m v^2 Drive slower and everyone is safer
- robnado 3y agoI feel that all those people who talk about reducing car size and use probably don’t have a family. I have twin 6 month olds and the only cars we currently use is the Toyota Corolla from a local car sharing service. Two car seats in the back leave basically just enough room between for my wife to fit sideways inside the middle seat. She can’t stay in there for longer than a few minutes and if we get in a car accident, she is not gonna have a good time. Also, have you tried putting a child in a car seat while avoiding hitting their head on the roof of the car? It’s a tricky thing. Those are two reasons that two people who worked hard on reducing their environmental footprint end up in a situation where we have to look into buying an SUV. And don’t get me started on avoiding cars altogether: with hospital appointments that take 15 min to drive to but would take hours of public transit to get to, the need to buy more food at a cheaper price and the fact that transit options are often not accessible with a stroller (good luck bringing a double stroller up and down a few flights of stairs) means that you need to use a car. My suggestion: please either fix public transit so families can actually use it and organise the city so services are accessible, or offer cars that can accommodate a reasonable sized family while being environmentally friendly. Fyi, I live downtown in a major North American city that is known for having good public transit.
- deleted 3y ago[deleted]
- yrro 3y agoAll valid problems. The car lobby (and their pet politicians) aren't going to do anything to fix it though. And we will all have to live with the consequences.
- robnado 3y agoAgreed, instead of addressing any of the problems that push people to buy big gas guzzlers, they leverage those problems to divide the population. If you look, you will see these wedge issues everywhere. We won't get anywhere at addressing any pressing issues in our society if we let the medias keep dividing us.
- hotpotamus 3y ago
- tonyedgecombe 3y ago>In Oxford they largely don't bother Funnily enough I saw a traffic warden issuing tickets in Oxford last week.
- yrro 3y agoWas it by chance on August the 30th? That would have co-incideded with the ultra rare "blue supermoon". Next one is in 203x...
- tonyedgecombe 3y agoI was in Oxford again today and saw another one.