4 ms·

You like counterfeit foods? This "cartel" does not care about others making same cheese even using the same recipe, they just care about protecting the name. F

by theamk 3y ago

You like counterfeit foods? This "cartel" does not care about others making same cheese even using the same recipe, they just care about protecting the name. For example Kraft sells their own version of parmesan in EU without any problems, they just call it "Pamesello" In other words, it's not a patent, it's a trademark. Those are much more acceptable IMHO, and are often good.

14 3y ago
Sounds like they are gatekeeping to me. Anyone can make vodka and sell it as what ever brand they want. Sounds like these guys don’t want anyone making Parmasan cheese which is a type of cheese not a brand. Why can’t someone make Ben or Jerry’s Parmesan cheese? If it tastes better then the original stuff then so be it let the market decide - or are they a cartel controlling who sells what by means of coercion and laws stacked against anyone who tries to enter the market?
- petre 3y ago
  It's not Parmigiano Reggiano unless it's made in a specific region, just like Champagne sparkling wine or Hungarian Palinka fruit brandy. Just call it whatever you want and let the market decide. One can also call it Parmesan outside the EU without getting sued. https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryolmsted/2012/11/19/the-dark-side-of-parmesan-cheese-what-you-dont-know-might-hurt-you/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryolmsted/2012/11/19/the-dar...
  - strbean 3y ago
    What's wrong with establishing a governing body to give it's seal of approval, and letting consumers rely on that? If we had DOPs from the outset, we'd have a huge number of extra names for the non-regional versions of foods. Additionally, Italian regulatory bodies are well known for not giving a shit about the products that are exported from Italy, so getting the certified "real thing" isn't a good indicator that, for example, your olive oil is even real olive oil.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - petre 3y ago
      There is a whole host of such bodies in every EA Multilateral Agreement signatory contry. They're called NABs (national acreditation bodies), there are other CABs (conformity acreditation bodies). Also EA MLA signatories include non EU contries such as the UK, Turkye, Albania, Ukraine, Egypt, etc. https://european-accreditation.org https://european-accreditation.org Olive oil is just vegetable oil made out of olives, but if "Lakonia olive oil" is registered as a PDO then it could only be made in the Greek region of Lakonia using local olives. Olive oil adulterated with other vegetable oils shouldn't be called "olive oil" in the first place. Some "Italian" olive oils are actually from Spain or a mix due to more competitive prices from Spain and EU subsidies. Btw, 2023 is a disastrous year for olive oil producers in Spain because of the spring heatwave which affected the flowering. It's so bad that there was a heist last week involving two tank trailers containing 500 hl worth of Spanish olive oil ready for bottling, totaling €0.5M.
      - strbean 3y ago
        I wasn't very clear what my point was: What is wrong with relying on the trademark for such a body's seal of approval, rather than constructing what is essentially a trademark on the name of a product, which is already firmly part of the commons? Why do you need to prohibit others from using the name Parmesan, when consumers can look for the seal (if the body is trustworthy)? > Olive oil is just... https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2016/02/10/the-olive-oil-scam-if-80-is-fake-why-do-you-keep-buying-it/?sh=397e4987639d https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2016/02/10/the... Salient bit: > Even the labels bearing the coveted "Protected Designation of Origin" or PDO stamp indicating the precise geographical origin of a particular extra virgin olive oil to ensure the quality of that region’s agricultural products, and which are subjected to more strict controls, have not escaped the illegal trend. If the government-sanctioned group that gets to essentially trademark terms hundreds of years old (and take them out of the commons) can't do a good job ensuring that the product isn't adulterated, maybe it would be better if these were industry-established groups that could compete with each other to establish a reputation of reliability.

by theamk 3y ago

14 3y ago

Sounds like they are gatekeeping to me. Anyone can make vodka and sell it as what ever brand they want. Sounds like these guys don’t want anyone making Parmasan cheese which is a type of cheese not a brand. Why can’t someone make Ben or Jerry’s Parmesan cheese? If it tastes better then the original stuff then so be it let the market decide - or are they a cartel controlling who sells what by means of coercion and laws stacked against anyone who tries to enter the market?

petre 3y ago
It's not Parmigiano Reggiano unless it's made in a specific region, just like Champagne sparkling wine or Hungarian Palinka fruit brandy. Just call it whatever you want and let the market decide. One can also call it Parmesan outside the EU without getting sued. https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryolmsted/2012/11/19/the-dark-side-of-parmesan-cheese-what-you-dont-know-might-hurt-you/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/larryolmsted/2012/11/19/the-dar...
- strbean 3y ago
  What's wrong with establishing a governing body to give it's seal of approval, and letting consumers rely on that? If we had DOPs from the outset, we'd have a huge number of extra names for the non-regional versions of foods. Additionally, Italian regulatory bodies are well known for not giving a shit about the products that are exported from Italy, so getting the certified "real thing" isn't a good indicator that, for example, your olive oil is even real olive oil.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - petre 3y ago
    There is a whole host of such bodies in every EA Multilateral Agreement signatory contry. They're called NABs (national acreditation bodies), there are other CABs (conformity acreditation bodies). Also EA MLA signatories include non EU contries such as the UK, Turkye, Albania, Ukraine, Egypt, etc. https://european-accreditation.org https://european-accreditation.org Olive oil is just vegetable oil made out of olives, but if "Lakonia olive oil" is registered as a PDO then it could only be made in the Greek region of Lakonia using local olives. Olive oil adulterated with other vegetable oils shouldn't be called "olive oil" in the first place. Some "Italian" olive oils are actually from Spain or a mix due to more competitive prices from Spain and EU subsidies. Btw, 2023 is a disastrous year for olive oil producers in Spain because of the spring heatwave which affected the flowering. It's so bad that there was a heist last week involving two tank trailers containing 500 hl worth of Spanish olive oil ready for bottling, totaling €0.5M.
    - strbean 3y ago
      I wasn't very clear what my point was: What is wrong with relying on the trademark for such a body's seal of approval, rather than constructing what is essentially a trademark on the name of a product, which is already firmly part of the commons? Why do you need to prohibit others from using the name Parmesan, when consumers can look for the seal (if the body is trustworthy)? > Olive oil is just... https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2016/02/10/the-olive-oil-scam-if-80-is-fake-why-do-you-keep-buying-it/?sh=397e4987639d https://www.forbes.com/sites/ceciliarodriguez/2016/02/10/the... Salient bit: > Even the labels bearing the coveted "Protected Designation of Origin" or PDO stamp indicating the precise geographical origin of a particular extra virgin olive oil to ensure the quality of that region’s agricultural products, and which are subjected to more strict controls, have not escaped the illegal trend. If the government-sanctioned group that gets to essentially trademark terms hundreds of years old (and take them out of the commons) can't do a good job ensuring that the product isn't adulterated, maybe it would be better if these were industry-established groups that could compete with each other to establish a reputation of reliability.