2 ms·

What's the concern with unlimited PTO? (You're not the only one in this thread to express this and I'm legitimately curious.)

mr_mitm 3y ago
Without an enforced minimum you could be pressured either actively or passively into not taking as much PTO as you would have otherwise.
antasvara 3y ago
Because it's not actually unlimited in practice. After all, you would definitely be fired for taking an entire year off. So, when a company says "unlimited," what it tends to mean in reality is "there's a limit, but we won't tell you what it is." This manifests itself in people with unlimited PTO taking (on average) less time off than people with defined number of days. When you have a defined number of days, you know exactly what the limit is. In my experience, this results in people using most (if not all) of their vacation days. I will note that this largely seems to be a US thing.
soVeryTired 3y ago
I have it and strongly dislike it. “Undefined PTO” is a much better term than “Unlimited PTO”. There is a limit, the company just delegates the definition of that limit to team leads. It makes planning holidays uncomfortable since it’s never quite clear whether you’re pushing a boundary. Generally I just stick to the UK norm of 25-27 days plus public holidays. A generous but fixed allowance that you’re actually expected to use in full would be a much better system.
danwee 3y ago
From my perspective (with is not the American one): it feels like for every PTO day you need to convince your team/manager to get that day off. It's like they are making you a favour. Also, I know beforehand that "unlimited" is not unlimited (I think it's kinda obvious), but then how many days can I ask for? Is it 10? Is it 15? Is it 28? Let's say I have already asked 20 days off, and I see around most of my colleagues have only asked 10, that may trigger on me the idea of "damn, I probably shouldn't ask another day off". Or perhaps my manager thinks that I have been taking "too many" days off already. So, "unlimited" PTO is highly subjective. I prefer to be explicit about it and state the exact number of vacation days I am entitled to.
noodlesUK 3y ago
I believe there is another part to this - Normally if there is a defined amount of PTO which accumulates over time, the company will have to buy it out when the employee leaves. If the PTO is "unlimited", nothing accumulates, so there isn't anything to buy out other than any statutory holiday entitlement.

mr_mitm 3y ago

Without an enforced minimum you could be pressured either actively or passively into not taking as much PTO as you would have otherwise.

antasvara 3y ago

Because it's not actually unlimited in practice. After all, you would definitely be fired for taking an entire year off. So, when a company says "unlimited," what it tends to mean in reality is "there's a limit, but we won't tell you what it is." This manifests itself in people with unlimited PTO taking (on average) less time off than people with defined number of days. When you have a defined number of days, you know exactly what the limit is. In my experience, this results in people using most (if not all) of their vacation days. I will note that this largely seems to be a US thing.

soVeryTired 3y ago

I have it and strongly dislike it. “Undefined PTO” is a much better term than “Unlimited PTO”. There is a limit, the company just delegates the definition of that limit to team leads. It makes planning holidays uncomfortable since it’s never quite clear whether you’re pushing a boundary. Generally I just stick to the UK norm of 25-27 days plus public holidays. A generous but fixed allowance that you’re actually expected to use in full would be a much better system.

danwee 3y ago

From my perspective (with is not the American one): it feels like for every PTO day you need to convince your team/manager to get that day off. It's like they are making you a favour. Also, I know beforehand that "unlimited" is not unlimited (I think it's kinda obvious), but then how many days can I ask for? Is it 10? Is it 15? Is it 28? Let's say I have already asked 20 days off, and I see around most of my colleagues have only asked 10, that may trigger on me the idea of "damn, I probably shouldn't ask another day off". Or perhaps my manager thinks that I have been taking "too many" days off already. So, "unlimited" PTO is highly subjective. I prefer to be explicit about it and state the exact number of vacation days I am entitled to.

noodlesUK 3y ago

I believe there is another part to this - Normally if there is a defined amount of PTO which accumulates over time, the company will have to buy it out when the employee leaves. If the PTO is "unlimited", nothing accumulates, so there isn't anything to buy out other than any statutory holiday entitlement.