2 ms·

Oh, nice to know that headphone jack is actually built in. Was it not in the 13" version or do I really just misremember that it's not there? So then I guess µ

by lucb1e 3y ago

Oh, nice to know that headphone jack is actually built in. Was it not in the 13" version or do I really just misremember that it's not there? So then I guess µSD is the next to go. While a regression from the status quo (when you buy, y'know, any other laptop for half the price), I could live with that being external. Then there's 3 slots available for USB, which is what I have today as well. It's fewer than I would want, and would thus expect from a hacker laptop, but it's workable. I fully understand what you're saying about the advantage of picking what you want to have on it (let's ignore that every port costs extra and isn't just a configuration). Laptops used to come with both VGA and HDMI: being able to choose is indeed a boon. I don't know what happened to dual video output (how many hackers use multiple monitors?), but I'm old enough to feel like it being an either-or situation is also a regression from how I am used to things being. (I am reading HN currently via a VGA-to-HDMI adapter because, indeed, this laptop has no VGA anymore and replacing a functional screen at the optimal-for-me resolution felt wasteful for both, well, waste and for my wallet.)

kelnos 3y ago
> Was it not in the 13" version or do I really just misremember that it's not there? It's built into the 13" version as well. > when you buy, y'know, any other laptop for half the price Reading some of your comments here, you seem to have a huge misconception about the point of these laptops, and who they are for. If you are price sensitive, you are probably not going to buy a Framework laptop. They are not trying to compete with the $700-$1000 range of laptops. If you are the kind of person who routinely uses most or all of the 10 various ports present on some laptops with fixed ports, this laptop is probably not for you. Most people do not need all those ports. Four or six ports is generally fine for most people, and it's a bonus that the Framework lets them customize what those ports do. You seem to be constantly arguing about these shortcomings, when they are not in fact shortcomings to most people. Please... let it go?
- lucb1e 3y ago
  > If you are price sensitive, you are probably not going to buy a Framework laptop. A cost always has to match the value that the product brings to either the buyer themselves or to a cause they care about. For a modular laptop that has real hack value and good Linux support, I really am willing to pay a rather large premium. For example, I also bought a Fairphone which easily costs three times what comparable specs would otherwise set you back, but I really do value what these products both aim for (support for open software; sustainability through longevity). I don't think I'm being "price sensitive" if I say that ~double is too steep for a product that is neither significantly better for me nor for the planet¹. Am I? ¹I never had a laptop physically break in some way, so non-modular hardware that I own also simply lasts until developers decide they want to have another layer of indirection and we collectively get to upgrade anyway. Fairphone's premium partially goes towards more sustainable material sourcing and fair wages > You seem to be constantly arguing It feels like that, yes. I don't know why. Is there a better way I can approach these topics? Some way to frame it differently in my head so it's not arguing, but more constructive somehow. Not that everything here has to be constructive and helpful, like, discussing a topic is not necessarily only saying how wonderful everything is because it simply isn't always wonderful, but it still feels like all I do online is argue and complain. The option that I can see is to simply not post when the message isn't positive, and I've tried that in the past, but being a passive observer is also rather meaningless or dull. Is there another way to improve this that you know of? For what it's worth, it did help me to post this because someone pointed out the headphone jack is actually built in, and that made me think "okay and then I can also forfeit the SD slot and then it works out". So Framework is still an option, and maybe I'll love the product if I decide to get one. But how to get to this point without making people feel like... well, like this I guess: > Please... let it go?

by lucb1e 3y ago

kelnos 3y ago

> Was it not in the 13" version or do I really just misremember that it's not there? It's built into the 13" version as well. > when you buy, y'know, any other laptop for half the price Reading some of your comments here, you seem to have a huge misconception about the point of these laptops, and who they are for. If you are price sensitive, you are probably not going to buy a Framework laptop. They are not trying to compete with the $700-$1000 range of laptops. If you are the kind of person who routinely uses most or all of the 10 various ports present on some laptops with fixed ports, this laptop is probably not for you. Most people do not need all those ports. Four or six ports is generally fine for most people, and it's a bonus that the Framework lets them customize what those ports do. You seem to be constantly arguing about these shortcomings, when they are not in fact shortcomings to most people. Please... let it go?

lucb1e 3y ago
> If you are price sensitive, you are probably not going to buy a Framework laptop. A cost always has to match the value that the product brings to either the buyer themselves or to a cause they care about. For a modular laptop that has real hack value and good Linux support, I really am willing to pay a rather large premium. For example, I also bought a Fairphone which easily costs three times what comparable specs would otherwise set you back, but I really do value what these products both aim for (support for open software; sustainability through longevity). I don't think I'm being "price sensitive" if I say that ~double is too steep for a product that is neither significantly better for me nor for the planet¹. Am I? ¹I never had a laptop physically break in some way, so non-modular hardware that I own also simply lasts until developers decide they want to have another layer of indirection and we collectively get to upgrade anyway. Fairphone's premium partially goes towards more sustainable material sourcing and fair wages > You seem to be constantly arguing It feels like that, yes. I don't know why. Is there a better way I can approach these topics? Some way to frame it differently in my head so it's not arguing, but more constructive somehow. Not that everything here has to be constructive and helpful, like, discussing a topic is not necessarily only saying how wonderful everything is because it simply isn't always wonderful, but it still feels like all I do online is argue and complain. The option that I can see is to simply not post when the message isn't positive, and I've tried that in the past, but being a passive observer is also rather meaningless or dull. Is there another way to improve this that you know of? For what it's worth, it did help me to post this because someone pointed out the headphone jack is actually built in, and that made me think "okay and then I can also forfeit the SD slot and then it works out". So Framework is still an option, and maybe I'll love the product if I decide to get one. But how to get to this point without making people feel like... well, like this I guess: > Please... let it go?