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Is it weird to anyone else how completely they avoid talking about the actual technologies involved? It just keeps saying “design system.” So… is it just a bun

Is it weird to anyone else how completely they avoid talking about the actual technologies involved? It just keeps saying “design system.” So… is it just a bunch of SASS files and icons? Or is it web components? Or is it react/vue/angular components? Are there tests? Is there a storybook? It seems like all that stuff should be front and center on the landing page

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petepete 3y ago
It's a set of styles and guidance on how to use them in a universally accessible manner. You're unlikely to build anything that's usable by everyone using React/Vue/Angular. I mean, it is possible, but it's hard enough to get right with plain HTML and CSS - adding a load of JavaScript to the mix just confuses matters.
- KronisLV 3y ago
  > You're unlikely to build anything that's usable by everyone using React/Vue/Angular. I wonder why so few actually try doing this. I mentioned this in another comment, but PrimeFaces is one of the few (only one?) sets of usable components, that have libraries available for Angular/React/Vue/Java (though using Java is a bit of a mess because of JSF, though some like it): https://www.primefaces.org/ https://www.primefaces.org/ It's immensely cool to be able to use similar components and such across different technologies, as opposed to wanting one of those component libraries and thus being pigeonholed into either using just React (or something else), or third party bindings of questionable quality. It's probably never going to be truly 1:1, but getting close enough seems like a good thing to me, here's an example of a random component: https://primeng.org/treetable https://primeng.org/treetable https://primereact.org/treetable/ https://primereact.org/treetable/ https://primevue.org/treetable/ https://primevue.org/treetable/ https://www.primefaces.org/showcase/ui/data/treetable/basic.xhtml https://www.primefaces.org/showcase/ui/data/treetable/basic....
  - petepete 3y ago
    I didn't even know anyone had attempted this, that's really interesting - thank you for posting the links. In my statement you quoted above though, I was referring to the accessibility of components built using JS libraries. They introduce so many new moving parts, taking into account how every browser, OS, screen reader, other assistive tech, and all combinations of each will work is tremendously hard _without any JS_.
  - galaxyLogic 3y ago
    PrimeFaces looks interesting. Is it free as in free beer?
    - KronisLV 3y ago
      > Is it free as in free beer? PrimeNG: https://github.com/primefaces/primeng/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primeng/blob/master/LICENSE.md PrimeReact: https://github.com/primefaces/primereact/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primereact/blob/master/LICENSE... PrimeVue: https://github.com/primefaces/primevue/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primevue/blob/master/LICENSE.m... PrimeFaces: https://github.com/primefaces/primefaces/blob/master/LICENSE https://github.com/primefaces/primefaces/blob/master/LICENSE They do have their own store, where they try to sell all sorts of products (custom themes, templates, LTS support, things like that), though I haven't felt the need to get any of those and just use the regular components and additional free utilities (flexbox utilities and icons). There is more information on their main website: https://www.primefaces.org https://www.primefaces.org
  - mock-possum 3y ago
    huh, I didn't know about this! thanks!
Uehreka 3y ago
It’s not weird. When you’re dealing with an organization as big as the US government, you’re not going to be able to standardize on a single technology for front end engineering. So you say “Make all your stuff look like this” as an opening statement, and then secondarily work with certain large departments to implement the visual stuff (1em padding on modals, 5px rounded edges on cards, tooltips on icon buttons etc) in the technology that each is using. You won’t be able to get to everyone, but the people you don’t get to (say, the DEA weirdos using MooTools and Stylus) will at least have some guidelines they can follow instead of just coming up with styles on their own.

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petepete 3y ago

It's a set of styles and guidance on how to use them in a universally accessible manner. You're unlikely to build anything that's usable by everyone using React/Vue/Angular. I mean, it is possible, but it's hard enough to get right with plain HTML and CSS - adding a load of JavaScript to the mix just confuses matters.

KronisLV 3y ago
> You're unlikely to build anything that's usable by everyone using React/Vue/Angular. I wonder why so few actually try doing this. I mentioned this in another comment, but PrimeFaces is one of the few (only one?) sets of usable components, that have libraries available for Angular/React/Vue/Java (though using Java is a bit of a mess because of JSF, though some like it): https://www.primefaces.org/ https://www.primefaces.org/ It's immensely cool to be able to use similar components and such across different technologies, as opposed to wanting one of those component libraries and thus being pigeonholed into either using just React (or something else), or third party bindings of questionable quality. It's probably never going to be truly 1:1, but getting close enough seems like a good thing to me, here's an example of a random component: https://primeng.org/treetable https://primeng.org/treetable https://primereact.org/treetable/ https://primereact.org/treetable/ https://primevue.org/treetable/ https://primevue.org/treetable/ https://www.primefaces.org/showcase/ui/data/treetable/basic.xhtml https://www.primefaces.org/showcase/ui/data/treetable/basic....
- petepete 3y ago
  I didn't even know anyone had attempted this, that's really interesting - thank you for posting the links. In my statement you quoted above though, I was referring to the accessibility of components built using JS libraries. They introduce so many new moving parts, taking into account how every browser, OS, screen reader, other assistive tech, and all combinations of each will work is tremendously hard _without any JS_.
- galaxyLogic 3y ago
  PrimeFaces looks interesting. Is it free as in free beer?
  - KronisLV 3y ago
    > Is it free as in free beer? PrimeNG: https://github.com/primefaces/primeng/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primeng/blob/master/LICENSE.md PrimeReact: https://github.com/primefaces/primereact/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primereact/blob/master/LICENSE... PrimeVue: https://github.com/primefaces/primevue/blob/master/LICENSE.md https://github.com/primefaces/primevue/blob/master/LICENSE.m... PrimeFaces: https://github.com/primefaces/primefaces/blob/master/LICENSE https://github.com/primefaces/primefaces/blob/master/LICENSE They do have their own store, where they try to sell all sorts of products (custom themes, templates, LTS support, things like that), though I haven't felt the need to get any of those and just use the regular components and additional free utilities (flexbox utilities and icons). There is more information on their main website: https://www.primefaces.org https://www.primefaces.org
- mock-possum 3y ago
  huh, I didn't know about this! thanks!

Uehreka 3y ago

It’s not weird. When you’re dealing with an organization as big as the US government, you’re not going to be able to standardize on a single technology for front end engineering. So you say “Make all your stuff look like this” as an opening statement, and then secondarily work with certain large departments to implement the visual stuff (1em padding on modals, 5px rounded edges on cards, tooltips on icon buttons etc) in the technology that each is using. You won’t be able to get to everyone, but the people you don’t get to (say, the DEA weirdos using MooTools and Stylus) will at least have some guidelines they can follow instead of just coming up with styles on their own.