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"PHP is dead" is dead. The amount of people praising PHP these days is quite high and increasing. Of course I may also be in a bubble (of php devs), but I have

"PHP is dead" is dead. The amount of people praising PHP these days is quite high and increasing. Of course I may also be in a bubble (of php devs), but I have seen a constant increase from JS-people starting to look (and in some cases, convert to) php. Also, many new youtube videos highlighting the new stuff in the language, how modern it is, etc. Honestly, anyone that blindly criticizes or dismisses php these days, is a big red-flag for me.

jbverschoor 3y ago
Well the problem is that "the internet" (google, stackoverflow) does not (by default) filter out any old/obsolete information. People googling for solutions will get 30+ year old "advise" on how to do certain things / use certain libraries etc. Especially StackOverflow should be incorporating a major version number for which the question is valid. So yes, "PHP is still dead" as long as you get the same old advise.
- nunodonato 3y ago
  that's very true. But it is true for PHP as it is for any other language or tech that is at least a decade old. Interesting fact: chatgpt can recognize old stuff and give better recommendations
  - jbverschoor 3y ago
    Still, somehow it’s more true for php.. maybe because other languages invest more in migrating to newer standards. Maybe because so many projects are self-hosted by non-programmers, in which case it makes sense to be conservative
    - gregjor 3y ago
      Can you name one or two "newer standards" that "other languages" have invested more in migrating to, compared to PHP? Did you mean standard, as in HTML5 or ES6? Or something more like a fashion or fad, like FP or OOP (which PHP has had for a long time)? People ask the same old questions about PHP on StackOverflow et al. because a lot of people start with PHP and as beginners they will have the same questions every beginner had before them, and the same lack of ability figuring things out themselves or finding their questions already answered. That has nothing to do with PHP per se except that PHP offers a very easy on-ramp to getting started with web development, so a lot of newbs start there. If you look at the W3Techs methodology, posted on their site for all to see but apparently few to bother with, you will see that self-hosted hobbyist and learning projects aren't going to make it into their results.
- 8organicbits 3y ago
  StackOverflow has been trying to address that problem. I've recently seen them show a newer answer on top of the "accepted" answer even though it had fewer votes. This helps the answer evolve over time. https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/405302/introducing-outdated-answers-project https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/405302/introducing-...
  - jbverschoor 3y ago
    But that’s not the problem. The problem is that the questions are old. It’s better to have the same question in a new era. The version info should be in the question. The question has either been answered or not, but it’s not relevant anymore for the original poster. Only if it really is, you could add a new major version to it to indicate compatibility
    - 8organicbits 3y ago
      I'm not sure I see the distinction. I've needed help doing "X", I googled "how to do X", and found ancient stackoverflow questions. The page has recent answers ranked the highest saying things like: "in recent years you should use the Y feature to do X". I haven't seen anyone get upset that the Y feature didn't exist when the question was posted. Questions are often timeless. The answers change and SO shows them all with their timestamps ordered by its best guess at which will help you, the reader, not the original poster.
nikanj 3y ago
It’s like meeting someone in 2023 who hates Micro$oft WinBLOWZ. Have they been stuck in stasis for 20 years? What other values from the 9/11 era do they hang on to?
- dash2 3y ago
  This reminds me of the sysadmin at a Greek university I once worked in back in 2009 or so. He had installed Linux at every one of the computer labs' computers. He'd changed the startup software to describe Windows as Windows UnProfessional. The default was Linux, and it would boot within 3 seconds unless you quickly changed it. Under Linux he'd included all the Gnome 2 window manager flash, including spinning cubes and windows that went up in flames when you closed them.... He convinced my friend to install Linux on her laptop. Good times.
  - quickthrower2 3y ago
    A budding RMS!
  - oaiey 3y ago
    I like the fun spirit of it. We do not have these people anymore.
- archerx 3y ago
  Ironically since windows 11, after being pro windows since version 3.11 I have pretty much turned disdainful to Micro$hit WangBLOWz. What a time to be alive.
- croes 3y ago
  You mean like hating MS for putting ads in the OS? MS didn't change, they still exploit as much as they can. And they try to force people people into the cloud unable to secure their own software stack. MS didn't get better just because Google got worse.
  - nunodonato 3y ago
    Don't forget that now Microsoft ♥ Linux

jbverschoor 3y ago

Well the problem is that "the internet" (google, stackoverflow) does not (by default) filter out any old/obsolete information. People googling for solutions will get 30+ year old "advise" on how to do certain things / use certain libraries etc. Especially StackOverflow should be incorporating a major version number for which the question is valid. So yes, "PHP is still dead" as long as you get the same old advise.

nunodonato 3y ago
that's very true. But it is true for PHP as it is for any other language or tech that is at least a decade old. Interesting fact: chatgpt can recognize old stuff and give better recommendations
- jbverschoor 3y ago
  Still, somehow it’s more true for php.. maybe because other languages invest more in migrating to newer standards. Maybe because so many projects are self-hosted by non-programmers, in which case it makes sense to be conservative
  - gregjor 3y ago
    Can you name one or two "newer standards" that "other languages" have invested more in migrating to, compared to PHP? Did you mean standard, as in HTML5 or ES6? Or something more like a fashion or fad, like FP or OOP (which PHP has had for a long time)? People ask the same old questions about PHP on StackOverflow et al. because a lot of people start with PHP and as beginners they will have the same questions every beginner had before them, and the same lack of ability figuring things out themselves or finding their questions already answered. That has nothing to do with PHP per se except that PHP offers a very easy on-ramp to getting started with web development, so a lot of newbs start there. If you look at the W3Techs methodology, posted on their site for all to see but apparently few to bother with, you will see that self-hosted hobbyist and learning projects aren't going to make it into their results.
8organicbits 3y ago
StackOverflow has been trying to address that problem. I've recently seen them show a newer answer on top of the "accepted" answer even though it had fewer votes. This helps the answer evolve over time. https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/405302/introducing-outdated-answers-project https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/405302/introducing-...
- jbverschoor 3y ago
  But that’s not the problem. The problem is that the questions are old. It’s better to have the same question in a new era. The version info should be in the question. The question has either been answered or not, but it’s not relevant anymore for the original poster. Only if it really is, you could add a new major version to it to indicate compatibility
  - 8organicbits 3y ago
    I'm not sure I see the distinction. I've needed help doing "X", I googled "how to do X", and found ancient stackoverflow questions. The page has recent answers ranked the highest saying things like: "in recent years you should use the Y feature to do X". I haven't seen anyone get upset that the Y feature didn't exist when the question was posted. Questions are often timeless. The answers change and SO shows them all with their timestamps ordered by its best guess at which will help you, the reader, not the original poster.

nikanj 3y ago

It’s like meeting someone in 2023 who hates Micro$oft WinBLOWZ. Have they been stuck in stasis for 20 years? What other values from the 9/11 era do they hang on to?

dash2 3y ago
This reminds me of the sysadmin at a Greek university I once worked in back in 2009 or so. He had installed Linux at every one of the computer labs' computers. He'd changed the startup software to describe Windows as Windows UnProfessional. The default was Linux, and it would boot within 3 seconds unless you quickly changed it. Under Linux he'd included all the Gnome 2 window manager flash, including spinning cubes and windows that went up in flames when you closed them.... He convinced my friend to install Linux on her laptop. Good times.
- quickthrower2 3y ago
  A budding RMS!
- oaiey 3y ago
  I like the fun spirit of it. We do not have these people anymore.
archerx 3y ago
Ironically since windows 11, after being pro windows since version 3.11 I have pretty much turned disdainful to Micro$hit WangBLOWz. What a time to be alive.
croes 3y ago
You mean like hating MS for putting ads in the OS? MS didn't change, they still exploit as much as they can. And they try to force people people into the cloud unable to secure their own software stack. MS didn't get better just because Google got worse.
- nunodonato 3y ago
  Don't forget that now Microsoft ♥ Linux