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For anyone extolling the virtues of credit cards as the ultimate payer-friendly solution, my "exhibit A" is a vendor who charged my card and then put a freeze o

For anyone extolling the virtues of credit cards as the ultimate payer-friendly solution, my "exhibit A" is a vendor who charged my card and then put a freeze on actually shipping the product. Then they tried calling me while my phone didn't have a signal. Then they sent me an email saying their "verification" department couldn't reach me and to let them know when they can call. I replied telling them when they could call. They didn't call. So I called them and sat on hold until someone finally picked up and told me that my order was flagged for some reason. After I confirmed my address (?), they seemed to confirm my order and then hung up. I still haven't gotten any confirmation that my item shipped yet. In general I try to avoid ordering from Amazon, but if I had done that instead, I would have my item in my hands right now. Instead I had to waste my time playing phone tag, and I'm still wondering whether or when they'll actually ship my item. All because the vendor is apparently super-averse to credit card fraud and would rather push me to Amazon for future purchases than take whatever chance they'd be taking by sending me what they've already charged me for. I'll have to be calling them again after the weekend to see if they've actually sent it. If they haven't, I'll tell them to cancel my order. And then I'll have to wait for them to refund the charges. If they don't, then I'll have to make another call to my bank to reverse the charges. All the while, I still don't have my item. So if you don't pay for fraud in lost cash, you're definitely paying the overhead of vendors trying to avoid being "stuck holding the bag" by throwing arbitrary verification processes in your face, introducing delays and possibly leading to you needing to make multiple phone calls to resolve problems while being left without the thing you need.

majormajor 3y ago
"Pay before the item ships" is nearly ubiquitous online even if you used Paypal or a debit card or whatever. Maybe if you'd used a method like that they'd not even be pretending to think about sending your item, vs just pocketing your cash. I'm not sure "vendor is so paranoid about fraud because credit cards are too consumer friendly, thus credit cards aren't payer-friendly" follows from this story more than "vendor is just acting in bad faith."
WalterBright 3y ago
Now and then someone "hacks" my pathetic Javascript shopping cart to buy software for $1 instead of the usual price. I just send them an email with a balance due for the rest of the purchase price. Never hear from them again. I accepted credit cards for many years until I was subjected to repeated "carding" attacks. The credit card processor blamed me for them, and was unable to tell me how to avoid such attacks. My solution was to not accept credit cards anymore.
- fragmede 3y ago
  I, too, throw my baby out with my bathwater.
stu2b50 3y ago
What part of that is the fault of using a credit card? I'm extra confused since Amazon came into this, where you distinctly are able to use credit cards? With a credit card, you have the fallback of chargebacking. That's the benefit. You haven't gotten to that stage, although you certainly could have escalated to there by now.
- steelframe 3y ago
  > What part of that is the fault of using a credit card? I'm extra confused since Amazon came into this, where you distinctly are able to use credit cards? Amazon, to my knowledge, will not charge you and then throw you into a "pending verification" quagmire. But I would imagine most vendors don't want you ordering from Amazon. My point is that when I make an effort to order from another vendor when I could just order from Amazon, that vendor should introduce exactly zero friction to the process in order to be competitive.
  - stu2b50 3y ago
    Sure, and that's the merchant's issue? There are no lack of merchants that take credit cards without any further measures like that. And because you used a credit card, you can, and probably should, just file a chargeback and be done with it.
constantly 3y ago
This is a really good story to highlight how good credit cards are for this situation. It’s totally reasonable for a vendor to freeze shipping via credit card purchase until they’ve received confirmation they will be paid. Basically modern escrow. Sorry you seem to have been caught up in a rare edge case, I’ve been in the same situation, but am super happy that the system makes 99% of payments totally frictionless unless occasionally I’m traveling abroad (or ordering abroad) and they have additional checks. Long live the virtues of credit card payments!
- steelframe 3y ago
  > It’s totally reasonable for a vendor to freeze shipping via credit card purchase until they’ve received confirmation they will be paid. Exactly, but I come to the stellar opposite conclusion than you do in this scenario. I would much rather have used a payment mechanism with this vendor that immediately and finally transferred the funds so that I get my item more quickly without playing 3 days of phone tag. BTW, this is a large and established vendor that I trust. You have likely ordered something from them in the past.

majormajor 3y ago

"Pay before the item ships" is nearly ubiquitous online even if you used Paypal or a debit card or whatever. Maybe if you'd used a method like that they'd not even be pretending to think about sending your item, vs just pocketing your cash. I'm not sure "vendor is so paranoid about fraud because credit cards are too consumer friendly, thus credit cards aren't payer-friendly" follows from this story more than "vendor is just acting in bad faith."

WalterBright 3y ago

Now and then someone "hacks" my pathetic Javascript shopping cart to buy software for $1 instead of the usual price. I just send them an email with a balance due for the rest of the purchase price. Never hear from them again. I accepted credit cards for many years until I was subjected to repeated "carding" attacks. The credit card processor blamed me for them, and was unable to tell me how to avoid such attacks. My solution was to not accept credit cards anymore.

fragmede 3y ago
I, too, throw my baby out with my bathwater.

stu2b50 3y ago

What part of that is the fault of using a credit card? I'm extra confused since Amazon came into this, where you distinctly are able to use credit cards? With a credit card, you have the fallback of chargebacking. That's the benefit. You haven't gotten to that stage, although you certainly could have escalated to there by now.

steelframe 3y ago
> What part of that is the fault of using a credit card? I'm extra confused since Amazon came into this, where you distinctly are able to use credit cards? Amazon, to my knowledge, will not charge you and then throw you into a "pending verification" quagmire. But I would imagine most vendors don't want you ordering from Amazon. My point is that when I make an effort to order from another vendor when I could just order from Amazon, that vendor should introduce exactly zero friction to the process in order to be competitive.
- stu2b50 3y ago
  Sure, and that's the merchant's issue? There are no lack of merchants that take credit cards without any further measures like that. And because you used a credit card, you can, and probably should, just file a chargeback and be done with it.

constantly 3y ago

This is a really good story to highlight how good credit cards are for this situation. It’s totally reasonable for a vendor to freeze shipping via credit card purchase until they’ve received confirmation they will be paid. Basically modern escrow. Sorry you seem to have been caught up in a rare edge case, I’ve been in the same situation, but am super happy that the system makes 99% of payments totally frictionless unless occasionally I’m traveling abroad (or ordering abroad) and they have additional checks. Long live the virtues of credit card payments!

steelframe 3y ago
> It’s totally reasonable for a vendor to freeze shipping via credit card purchase until they’ve received confirmation they will be paid. Exactly, but I come to the stellar opposite conclusion than you do in this scenario. I would much rather have used a payment mechanism with this vendor that immediately and finally transferred the funds so that I get my item more quickly without playing 3 days of phone tag. BTW, this is a large and established vendor that I trust. You have likely ordered something from them in the past.