5 ms·

I for one am interested why it's specifically AI girlfriend ads and not AI boyfriend ads. Heterosexual women are huge consumers of e.g. dating simulators, roman

I for one am interested why it's specifically AI girlfriend ads and not AI boyfriend ads. Heterosexual women are huge consumers of e.g. dating simulators, romance books, et al. that envision perfect men, bad boys with sweet hearts, wealthy powerful high-earning men who somehow always make time for the beloved. You'd think there'd be just as many AI boyfriend ads-- what teenaged girl wouldn't pay huge money to date $popular_male_singer? [Example comparison: I know for a fact that popular romance publishing houses have straight up algorithmic-level demands of books published with them. Kiss must happen by page X. First sex must happen by chapter Y. Happily Ever After is mandatory, etc. These publishing houses make huge money, maybe the most well-earning genre in all of books.]

Racing0461 3y ago
> what teenaged girl wouldn't pay huge money to date $popular_male_singer Women already have a dating simulator. It's called instagram and dating apps.
- EatingWithForks 3y ago
  I don't think so, actually. Dealing with real men (through a dating app) means dealing with flawed humans beings in a way that simply doesn't happen in a romance book, same as dealing with real women vs OnlyFans. Men sleep, disagree, forget anniversaries and birthdays, negotiate compromises, and can fall out of love in a way an AI boyfriend wouldn't. Just like real women vs AI girlfriend. So I just don't know why only AI girlfriend ads are flooding social media apps, which we know (at least on Instagram) actually primarily target women/women's body issues. Edited to add: not to mention a/s/l and dick pics! AI boyfriend would NEVER do that, while in a dating app your average woman would probably get that fairly regularly.
  - Racing0461 3y ago
    > Dealing with real men (through a dating app) means dealing with flawed humans beings That's why i said insta/dating apps is a simulator for women. They can interact with "perfect men" on these apps. the ideal firefighter with a golden retriever with a perfect relationship with his mom on tuesday and drake/blue check sliding into their dms on insta setting somthing up on friday. it's a simulator in the sense that women don't get marriage/commitment/a family from these "perfect men".
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      I don't really understand-- maybe because I've never been a woman on a dating app, but wdym by this? Are there fake men profiles on dating apps or something, and no similar women profiles? The only thing I know about women experiences in dating apps is when my female friends complain about receiving creepy messages through them.
      - Racing0461 3y ago
        If you want a current summary of the current dating landscape if you've been off the market for a while, check out The Rational Male books. it's a bit evo psychy but it seems to do a good job of summarizing everything.
  - maerF0x0 3y ago
    I think you're also hitting on part of the vein of why. Men (primarily) are not falling in love with their ai girlfriends, they are falling in lust. Note that the most prominent AI girlfriend/generator things focus on looks, not on if she will nurture you back to health after getting a bad cold or laid off.
    - scarmig 3y ago
      > Note that the most prominent AI girlfriend/generator things focus on looks I'd be curious if that's actually true. After all, there's porn for something purely based on looks, and where OnlyFans models make most of their money is by combining the looks with simulated emotional intimacy. Are the popular AI girlfriends purely sexbots, or is a primary part of their appeal that they offer simulacra of intimacy?
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      Well that's what I'm interested in, because obviously women actively consume primarily written media where you actively engage with a perfect (or "fixable") man-- romance books! Dating sim games! This seems way more suitable than AI girlfriend primarily porn, for which she doesn't need to be Intelligent to any real degree in comparison.
toseupthrow 3y ago
I think people are just not talking about it. Some of the top bots on character.ai are male and most of the "nsfw character ai" subreddit/communities are women who want to sext with "ai husbands"
whichfawkes 3y ago
Women can more readily get the kind of attention they want, with minimal effort. Getting emotionally invested in an AI seems to me like it would go hand in hand with giving up on human relationships. I'm pretty sure men are more likely to do that than women.
- RajT88 3y ago
  You nailed it. The article says: > Are said she believes that reflects a gender-based slant — social media platforms freely allow sex-related ads only if the intended audience is men. So when you've got a huge hungry audience, willing to pay money, the platforms are incentivized to enforce their rules about ads unequally. Content and apps geared towards women, or gay men, are such a small piece of the pie by comparison that there's less incentive to look the other way. The companies being accused of this unequal enforcement, of course, have a long history of doing things for no other reason than they can make a little extra money on it by not respecting their users. It's entirely believable.
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    > Content and apps geared towards women, or gay men, are such a small piece of the pie by comparison that there's less incentive to look the other way. Sorry, we're talking about Instagram, an app we know puts huge targets on women, especially young women! I have no idea what you're talking about here about nicheness. Fashion products alone are worth way more than the entire porn industry. Not including beauty, skincare, cosmetic surgery, wellness/cleansing, etc...
    - RajT88 3y ago
      There's more women, but the point is demand among women is not as high for such AI partners. The lack of demand makes the market niche.
      - EatingWithForks 3y ago
        I'm asking why the demand is not as high for male AI partners, when other media which also simulates male romantic partnership has HUGE demand. Just look at how much erotica makes. How many weird fetish stories are posted on fanfiction sites where the reader is a character. How much money stupid things like Boyfriend Dungeon (a real thing! a dungeon crawler where you date your exclusively-male weapons!) makes! You'd think AI boyfriends fit way closer to this existing market.
vsareto 3y ago
Bias, bias, bias. Either on the part of NBC or the companies and marketers themselves
cm2012 3y ago
It will absolutely be popular with women eventually. Erotica is just so incredibly popular. It's just that men make these AI tools so the first products will serve their needs.
ericmcer 3y ago
Why does it feel more exploitative in my brain to create an AI boyfriend to manipulate women than to drown men in pornography and sexual advertising.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- distant_hat 3y ago
  Because you are sexist.
maerF0x0 3y ago
Well, my own bias is because it's seen as depraved/pathetic if a man has an AI fantasy girlfriend which gives him a proxy of what he wants, but it's not if a woman reads her bodyweight in romance novels per year. In my experience it's seen as pathetic for a man to use a proxy for his desires (see also the sex toy industry). Another angle is go down the rabbit hole of online dating app disparity, women (under a certain age and bodyweight) can have a short term boyfriend and attention essentially immediately and in an unlimited manner. Partly driven by coolidge effect in men's sexual desires (men as a group have near unlimited desire for novelty and therefore consume any/all available supply except that which is not generally/widely desirable). Women already have a near proxy too. OnlyFans or an IG + cashapp account can mean she gets more from men than she could one man, and gives less that a wife would have had to in the past. An AI Boyfriend would have to give the things that women (on average) desire from men, which tends to be more like protection, resources/money, and status/social dominance. AI Girlfriends work because men tend to be driven towards visual things, and novelty.
- EatingWithForks 3y ago
  Your argument seems to be somewhat contradictory. You claim simultaneously that women can easily get the similar level of escapism attention from real men, but also Romance (an escapist fantasy that doesn't involve any real men, protection, resources/money, or status/social dominance) is a huge industry. How are both of these things true?
  - avgcorrection 3y ago
    Maybe because (1) “under a certain age and bodyweight” and (2) women who are in monogamous relationships but use Romance as a kind of escapism.
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      So like... only a portion of women. How is this any different from men? Again, this doesn't at all explain why this is so heavily heterosexual male skewed. It's not like a significant portion of women are hot 20somethings-- if anything, the proportion is skewed older compared to men simply because women live longer. I bet grandma would spend hella social security to be doted on by a hot shirtless lawyer.
janalsncm 3y ago
Probably the same reason women are the primary creators on Only Fans and men are the primary consumers? This is just an automated, less authentic version, which was already a tongue-in-cheek girlfriend simulator.
distant_hat 3y ago
You'd probably have to target the older women crowd. Teenage girls are at the peak of their sexual power and are actively fending off tons of interest every day. While they may be occasionally interested in something like this, I can't see them paying for it enough to be a viable market.
kaitai 3y ago
Because men & women are still overall looking for something different, that's my 2 cents. What you say about the romance publishing industry is roughly correct although your algo description flattens the diversity of the genre (note the popularity of shapeshifter novels, paranormal, Amish with no sex, etc etc; there are many subgenres). What you don't note is the distinction between romance and erotica. Romance has a story with a happily ever after. Can TikTok or Instagram AI Boyfriend ads provide a story satisfactorily? I'm not sure if research has really addressed evolution of women's expressions of sexuality over time and changing social norms. Even in the romance genre, what's considered appropriate in terms of consent and fantasy has evolved quite a bit over the last 40 years. That's true in terms of porn aimed at straight men as well, though not necessarily in the same directions. But anyhow, how would AI boyfriends continue what's popular about romance -- the customization (subgenre for every taste), the story, and the happily ever after or happy for now for the woman? The last part in particular doesn't seem to be relevant/considered in the AI girlfriend discussion, it's just not part of the structure. Also, dating sims seem to be popular in some geographies and not others; I know nothing about them, so there's got to be a story there...
swagasaurus-rex 3y ago
Here's an idea nobody has brought up yet: AI boyfriends are not good enough yet. Romance plots involve an intricate and complicated progression of emotions. Lonely guys need a lot less and don't mind skipping the romancing part of the romantic experience.
- Ancapistani 3y ago
  In think you’re right. Weird that a tool that is very well suited for a demographic is actively ignoring it, because it just isn’t good enough to fill the need yet.

Racing0461 3y ago

> what teenaged girl wouldn't pay huge money to date $popular_male_singer Women already have a dating simulator. It's called instagram and dating apps.

EatingWithForks 3y ago
I don't think so, actually. Dealing with real men (through a dating app) means dealing with flawed humans beings in a way that simply doesn't happen in a romance book, same as dealing with real women vs OnlyFans. Men sleep, disagree, forget anniversaries and birthdays, negotiate compromises, and can fall out of love in a way an AI boyfriend wouldn't. Just like real women vs AI girlfriend. So I just don't know why only AI girlfriend ads are flooding social media apps, which we know (at least on Instagram) actually primarily target women/women's body issues. Edited to add: not to mention a/s/l and dick pics! AI boyfriend would NEVER do that, while in a dating app your average woman would probably get that fairly regularly.
- Racing0461 3y ago
  > Dealing with real men (through a dating app) means dealing with flawed humans beings That's why i said insta/dating apps is a simulator for women. They can interact with "perfect men" on these apps. the ideal firefighter with a golden retriever with a perfect relationship with his mom on tuesday and drake/blue check sliding into their dms on insta setting somthing up on friday. it's a simulator in the sense that women don't get marriage/commitment/a family from these "perfect men".
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    I don't really understand-- maybe because I've never been a woman on a dating app, but wdym by this? Are there fake men profiles on dating apps or something, and no similar women profiles? The only thing I know about women experiences in dating apps is when my female friends complain about receiving creepy messages through them.
    - Racing0461 3y ago
      If you want a current summary of the current dating landscape if you've been off the market for a while, check out The Rational Male books. it's a bit evo psychy but it seems to do a good job of summarizing everything.
- maerF0x0 3y ago
  I think you're also hitting on part of the vein of why. Men (primarily) are not falling in love with their ai girlfriends, they are falling in lust. Note that the most prominent AI girlfriend/generator things focus on looks, not on if she will nurture you back to health after getting a bad cold or laid off.
  - scarmig 3y ago
    > Note that the most prominent AI girlfriend/generator things focus on looks I'd be curious if that's actually true. After all, there's porn for something purely based on looks, and where OnlyFans models make most of their money is by combining the looks with simulated emotional intimacy. Are the popular AI girlfriends purely sexbots, or is a primary part of their appeal that they offer simulacra of intimacy?
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    Well that's what I'm interested in, because obviously women actively consume primarily written media where you actively engage with a perfect (or "fixable") man-- romance books! Dating sim games! This seems way more suitable than AI girlfriend primarily porn, for which she doesn't need to be Intelligent to any real degree in comparison.

toseupthrow 3y ago

I think people are just not talking about it. Some of the top bots on character.ai are male and most of the "nsfw character ai" subreddit/communities are women who want to sext with "ai husbands"

whichfawkes 3y ago

Women can more readily get the kind of attention they want, with minimal effort. Getting emotionally invested in an AI seems to me like it would go hand in hand with giving up on human relationships. I'm pretty sure men are more likely to do that than women.

RajT88 3y ago
You nailed it. The article says: > Are said she believes that reflects a gender-based slant — social media platforms freely allow sex-related ads only if the intended audience is men. So when you've got a huge hungry audience, willing to pay money, the platforms are incentivized to enforce their rules about ads unequally. Content and apps geared towards women, or gay men, are such a small piece of the pie by comparison that there's less incentive to look the other way. The companies being accused of this unequal enforcement, of course, have a long history of doing things for no other reason than they can make a little extra money on it by not respecting their users. It's entirely believable.
- EatingWithForks 3y ago
  > Content and apps geared towards women, or gay men, are such a small piece of the pie by comparison that there's less incentive to look the other way. Sorry, we're talking about Instagram, an app we know puts huge targets on women, especially young women! I have no idea what you're talking about here about nicheness. Fashion products alone are worth way more than the entire porn industry. Not including beauty, skincare, cosmetic surgery, wellness/cleansing, etc...
  - RajT88 3y ago
    There's more women, but the point is demand among women is not as high for such AI partners. The lack of demand makes the market niche.
    - EatingWithForks 3y ago
      I'm asking why the demand is not as high for male AI partners, when other media which also simulates male romantic partnership has HUGE demand. Just look at how much erotica makes. How many weird fetish stories are posted on fanfiction sites where the reader is a character. How much money stupid things like Boyfriend Dungeon (a real thing! a dungeon crawler where you date your exclusively-male weapons!) makes! You'd think AI boyfriends fit way closer to this existing market.

vsareto 3y ago

Bias, bias, bias. Either on the part of NBC or the companies and marketers themselves

cm2012 3y ago

It will absolutely be popular with women eventually. Erotica is just so incredibly popular. It's just that men make these AI tools so the first products will serve their needs.

ericmcer 3y ago

Why does it feel more exploitative in my brain to create an AI boyfriend to manipulate women than to drown men in pornography and sexual advertising.

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
distant_hat 3y ago
Because you are sexist.

maerF0x0 3y ago

Well, my own bias is because it's seen as depraved/pathetic if a man has an AI fantasy girlfriend which gives him a proxy of what he wants, but it's not if a woman reads her bodyweight in romance novels per year. In my experience it's seen as pathetic for a man to use a proxy for his desires (see also the sex toy industry). Another angle is go down the rabbit hole of online dating app disparity, women (under a certain age and bodyweight) can have a short term boyfriend and attention essentially immediately and in an unlimited manner. Partly driven by coolidge effect in men's sexual desires (men as a group have near unlimited desire for novelty and therefore consume any/all available supply except that which is not generally/widely desirable). Women already have a near proxy too. OnlyFans or an IG + cashapp account can mean she gets more from men than she could one man, and gives less that a wife would have had to in the past. An AI Boyfriend would have to give the things that women (on average) desire from men, which tends to be more like protection, resources/money, and status/social dominance. AI Girlfriends work because men tend to be driven towards visual things, and novelty.

EatingWithForks 3y ago
Your argument seems to be somewhat contradictory. You claim simultaneously that women can easily get the similar level of escapism attention from real men, but also Romance (an escapist fantasy that doesn't involve any real men, protection, resources/money, or status/social dominance) is a huge industry. How are both of these things true?
- avgcorrection 3y ago
  Maybe because (1) “under a certain age and bodyweight” and (2) women who are in monogamous relationships but use Romance as a kind of escapism.
  - EatingWithForks 3y ago
    So like... only a portion of women. How is this any different from men? Again, this doesn't at all explain why this is so heavily heterosexual male skewed. It's not like a significant portion of women are hot 20somethings-- if anything, the proportion is skewed older compared to men simply because women live longer. I bet grandma would spend hella social security to be doted on by a hot shirtless lawyer.

janalsncm 3y ago

Probably the same reason women are the primary creators on Only Fans and men are the primary consumers? This is just an automated, less authentic version, which was already a tongue-in-cheek girlfriend simulator.

distant_hat 3y ago

You'd probably have to target the older women crowd. Teenage girls are at the peak of their sexual power and are actively fending off tons of interest every day. While they may be occasionally interested in something like this, I can't see them paying for it enough to be a viable market.

kaitai 3y ago

Because men & women are still overall looking for something different, that's my 2 cents. What you say about the romance publishing industry is roughly correct although your algo description flattens the diversity of the genre (note the popularity of shapeshifter novels, paranormal, Amish with no sex, etc etc; there are many subgenres). What you don't note is the distinction between romance and erotica. Romance has a story with a happily ever after. Can TikTok or Instagram AI Boyfriend ads provide a story satisfactorily? I'm not sure if research has really addressed evolution of women's expressions of sexuality over time and changing social norms. Even in the romance genre, what's considered appropriate in terms of consent and fantasy has evolved quite a bit over the last 40 years. That's true in terms of porn aimed at straight men as well, though not necessarily in the same directions. But anyhow, how would AI boyfriends continue what's popular about romance -- the customization (subgenre for every taste), the story, and the happily ever after or happy for now for the woman? The last part in particular doesn't seem to be relevant/considered in the AI girlfriend discussion, it's just not part of the structure. Also, dating sims seem to be popular in some geographies and not others; I know nothing about them, so there's got to be a story there...

swagasaurus-rex 3y ago

Here's an idea nobody has brought up yet: AI boyfriends are not good enough yet. Romance plots involve an intricate and complicated progression of emotions. Lonely guys need a lot less and don't mind skipping the romancing part of the romantic experience.

Ancapistani 3y ago
In think you’re right. Weird that a tool that is very well suited for a demographic is actively ignoring it, because it just isn’t good enough to fill the need yet.