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It does if we grant the two the same assumptions. If we assume that serious, unjustified harm would occur by failing to act, and they are in a reasonable positi

It does if we grant the two the same assumptions. If we assume that serious, unjustified harm would occur by failing to act, and they are in a reasonable position to act… then I’d say a private company is equally justified in doing the same thing. However, you’re assuming the government is justified merely because it’s the government.

nverno 3y ago
Maybe it depends on the country, but private companies cant generally get warrants to infringe on people's rights afaik. If justified is interpreted as 'legally justified', then it would make sense that only government agents could be justified to act in this manner. Of course, government agents are known to operate outside the law as well.
- goodluckchuck 3y ago
  I wouldn’t assume that private companies and individuals cannot get warrants. However, they look very different. The major distinction is that when a private party requests an injunction allowing them to e.g. trespass on their neighbor’s land, the court will require notice and a hearing for the defendant. So, if a chemical plant needs to do earth works on a neighbor’s land to prevent a collapse, etc. the judiciary may well issue an order requiring the neighbor to let the company enter. Frankly, notice and hearing should probably be required for some criminal warrants too. I can think of a few indictments and arrest warrants that have recently been issued where there is a genuine question as to probable cause and the alleged illegality of the conduct. It’s not fair for people who are not a flight risk to be arrested (and often imprisoned) with no opportunity to defend themselves.
  - nverno 3y ago
    yea, the justice system is quite the misnomer way too often
internetter 3y ago
Do you think private companies should be allowed to, say, arrest people?
- mcpackieh 3y ago
  Private companies aren't, but in certain circumstances private citizens working for those companies are. In the US (except perhaps Georgia?) if a crazy guy comes into your workplace waving a knife around, you're allowed to disarm him and pin him down on the ground. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest#United_States_of_America https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest#United_Stat...
- goodluckchuck 3y ago
  Depending on the circumstances, absolutely. Assuming that serious unjustified injury or death would occur if they failed to act, there should be some legal window in which they’re allowed to prevent the harm. Private companies (and individuals) should not be required to stand by helplessly while people are hurt. Indeed, legally, private individuals and companies are allowed to act in emergencies. For example, I generally should not break into my neighbor’s home. However, I am legally allowed (and morally obligated) to forcibly enter their residence if their house is on fire, or they’re being attacked by a burglar, etc. and I am able to prevent some of the harm. Of course, if we assume we’re talking about situations where the government needs a warrant, the legality becomes more complicated. At what point does something become an emergency? I would say it’s not an emergency if there is time to inform the government and to let the government prevent the injury. If we assume the government is unwilling or unable to act, then the window for action should expand by some measure.
  - comprev 3y ago
    You mean something like citizen's arrest? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest
    - goodluckchuck 3y ago

nverno 3y ago

Maybe it depends on the country, but private companies cant generally get warrants to infringe on people's rights afaik. If justified is interpreted as 'legally justified', then it would make sense that only government agents could be justified to act in this manner. Of course, government agents are known to operate outside the law as well.

goodluckchuck 3y ago
I wouldn’t assume that private companies and individuals cannot get warrants. However, they look very different. The major distinction is that when a private party requests an injunction allowing them to e.g. trespass on their neighbor’s land, the court will require notice and a hearing for the defendant. So, if a chemical plant needs to do earth works on a neighbor’s land to prevent a collapse, etc. the judiciary may well issue an order requiring the neighbor to let the company enter. Frankly, notice and hearing should probably be required for some criminal warrants too. I can think of a few indictments and arrest warrants that have recently been issued where there is a genuine question as to probable cause and the alleged illegality of the conduct. It’s not fair for people who are not a flight risk to be arrested (and often imprisoned) with no opportunity to defend themselves.
- nverno 3y ago
  yea, the justice system is quite the misnomer way too often

internetter 3y ago

Do you think private companies should be allowed to, say, arrest people?

mcpackieh 3y ago
Private companies aren't, but in certain circumstances private citizens working for those companies are. In the US (except perhaps Georgia?) if a crazy guy comes into your workplace waving a knife around, you're allowed to disarm him and pin him down on the ground. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest#United_States_of_America https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest#United_Stat...
goodluckchuck 3y ago
Depending on the circumstances, absolutely. Assuming that serious unjustified injury or death would occur if they failed to act, there should be some legal window in which they’re allowed to prevent the harm. Private companies (and individuals) should not be required to stand by helplessly while people are hurt. Indeed, legally, private individuals and companies are allowed to act in emergencies. For example, I generally should not break into my neighbor’s home. However, I am legally allowed (and morally obligated) to forcibly enter their residence if their house is on fire, or they’re being attacked by a burglar, etc. and I am able to prevent some of the harm. Of course, if we assume we’re talking about situations where the government needs a warrant, the legality becomes more complicated. At what point does something become an emergency? I would say it’s not an emergency if there is time to inform the government and to let the government prevent the injury. If we assume the government is unwilling or unable to act, then the window for action should expand by some measure.
- comprev 3y ago
  You mean something like citizen's arrest? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen%27s_arrest
  - goodluckchuck 3y ago