6 ms·

Do you have any references or evidence to back up this statement?

by realitysballs 3y ago

deleted 3y ago
[deleted]
corethree 3y ago
Do you live in california? Go outside and open your eyes for evidence.
- tomnipotent 3y ago
  In other words, you don't have any evidence.
  - corethree 3y ago
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvmpXURWlJg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvmpXURWlJg
  - senttoschool 3y ago
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC300808/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC300808/
  - PM_me_your_math 3y ago
    If you go outside, you will see what unfettered access to drugs does to a society. Of course, you don't need to go outside to see it, since you can do a search and find plenty of examples and studies. The truth can exist, even if someone doesn't want to do your homework for you. Late 19th century China comes to mind. Right now, one only needs to walk the streets of LA, NYC, Chicago, Charlotte, Orlando, Detroit, San Diego, Philly, Houston, San Antonio, Austin, and any other city. You will see this on the streets: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e72zMER95ps https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e72zMER95ps Is this really glamour? How is it helping, exactly? I don't see any purpose to unrestricted access to these substances, unless your goal is to shatter and/or destroy the lives of 20,000,000 Americans. I'll add that I think people should have a choice, but rights cease being rights when they impose on the rights of others. Weed, tobacco, and alcohol are legal, but that doesn't mean there is no cost to society. People do stupid shit after smoking. Tobacco has health care implications. Alcohol destroys families. Free access to fent, heroin, crack, cocaine, lsd, meth, and even mdma is going to incur a very big cost. Those are non-starters. And while I think mdma can be used under medical care, abuse of that specific drug incurs a debt.
    - amanaplanacanal 3y ago
      So about your list of cities and the masses of homeless in them. Are you saying that drugs are legal in all those cities? It seems like the homeless issue is completely orthogonal to drug decriminalization.
    - tomnipotent 3y ago
      The annual NSDUH survey disagrees with you. You know, actual evidence. And a random Sky News video about a specific increase in fentanyl-associated deaths where xylazine was detected is hardly evidence of larger trends. https://www.samhsa.gov/data/release/2021-national-survey-drug-use-and-health-nsduh-releases https://www.samhsa.gov/data/release/2021-national-survey-dru... > one only needs to walk the streets of LA So you follow one poor example of evidence with another. There are many confounding factors for why large cities are more likely to have observable population of unhoused and drug abuse, such as availability of services and facilities that treat vulnerable populations and the habit of smaller cities to ship their vulnerable populations to these areas. Let's not forget stagnant wages and disproportionate increases to the cost of living and lack of housing. Decriminalization also means we're not hiding away this vulnerable population by stuffing them in jails and treating the justice system as a half-assed mental health solution. Let's also not forget that the Greater Los Angeles area has a population equal to the states of Washington, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Utah combined. > Free access to fent, heroin, crack, cocaine, lsd, meth, and even mdma How do you jump from decriminalization to free drugs? What a silly attempt at a straw man.
  - corethree 3y ago
    In other words is the sky blue?
- Melting_Harps 3y ago
  > Do you live in california? Go outside and open your eyes for evidence. Not any more, but I was born there (multi-generational too) and visit often: I can assure you homelessness has been an issue long before either medical MJ or recreational legislation reforn; the massive effort the US states go to bus their undesirables is well documented [0] and a much larger reason for your 'evidence.' Skid row was arguably a direct byproduct of the Reagan era defunding of mental institutions, and I've come across anecdotal evidence that a large cohort was caused after releasing the broken and hapless former Japanese prisoners in internment camps during WW2: a Japanese colleague of mine found out her paternal grandmother spent time there for years (after she passed) while trying to find her biological family as an adult after having been adopted as a child. And guess what helped her get over this trauma and declining mental health issues? Psilocybin and MDMA and a caring partner that tried to be there for her. 0: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/20/bussed-out-america-moves-homeless-people-country-study https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/...
  - corethree 3y ago
    I was born here and I've lived here all my life. I still live here.
    - Melting_Harps 3y ago
      > I was born here and I've lived here all my life. I still live here. Your point? I'm here visiting right now, too. My point was that this State has always had a myriad of issues at any given time, but thinking MJ legalization and decriminalization led to all of this is absurd. I'm from SoCal and I recommend you go watch footage from the late 80s in LA during the crack epidemic, I lived through that as a child; LA country was ground zero for gang violence and crack is and remains illegal. The 90s were only slightly better, despite my nostalgia I'm well aware bank heists made the National news, as did the LA riots, and then the highly emblematic of SoCal culture high speed car chase that still gets people to watch the news to this day. CA has never been a safe place, we have to be tough to live through cycles of drought/earthquake/crime-waves/fires for generations and if you were born here, you'd already know that: these transplants have been deluded by Hollywood into thinking otherwise and think homelessness is a recent phenomenon because Joe Rogan, Elon and his cohort of influencers fled to Texas. Only to realize Texas is a much bigger s**hole than they anticipated with way more homelessness than they were promised. There was a recent article posted here that tech workers and companies are regretting leaving CA because how things have played out in Texas and it's 'good old boy' way of doing things, it's still the South after all: what did you expect?! You have to be a fool to think they were going to tolerate the SV 'woke' culture outside of Austin? Sidenote: The compassion act made MJ legal since the 90s, and it was incredibly easy to get a medical/red card (I had one without even being a resident of CA anymore while living in CO); I actually preferred that over recreational for reasons I won't explain here, and I can assure you beer was harder to get in the early 2000s as a HS student than high-grade MJ was.

Do you have any references or evidence to back up this statement?

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]

corethree 3y ago

Do you live in california? Go outside and open your eyes for evidence.

tomnipotent 3y ago
In other words, you don't have any evidence.
- corethree 3y ago
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvmpXURWlJg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvmpXURWlJg
- senttoschool 3y ago
  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC300808/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC300808/
- PM_me_your_math 3y ago
  If you go outside, you will see what unfettered access to drugs does to a society. Of course, you don't need to go outside to see it, since you can do a search and find plenty of examples and studies. The truth can exist, even if someone doesn't want to do your homework for you. Late 19th century China comes to mind. Right now, one only needs to walk the streets of LA, NYC, Chicago, Charlotte, Orlando, Detroit, San Diego, Philly, Houston, San Antonio, Austin, and any other city. You will see this on the streets: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e72zMER95ps https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e72zMER95ps Is this really glamour? How is it helping, exactly? I don't see any purpose to unrestricted access to these substances, unless your goal is to shatter and/or destroy the lives of 20,000,000 Americans. I'll add that I think people should have a choice, but rights cease being rights when they impose on the rights of others. Weed, tobacco, and alcohol are legal, but that doesn't mean there is no cost to society. People do stupid shit after smoking. Tobacco has health care implications. Alcohol destroys families. Free access to fent, heroin, crack, cocaine, lsd, meth, and even mdma is going to incur a very big cost. Those are non-starters. And while I think mdma can be used under medical care, abuse of that specific drug incurs a debt.
  - amanaplanacanal 3y ago
    So about your list of cities and the masses of homeless in them. Are you saying that drugs are legal in all those cities? It seems like the homeless issue is completely orthogonal to drug decriminalization.
  - tomnipotent 3y ago
    The annual NSDUH survey disagrees with you. You know, actual evidence. And a random Sky News video about a specific increase in fentanyl-associated deaths where xylazine was detected is hardly evidence of larger trends. https://www.samhsa.gov/data/release/2021-national-survey-drug-use-and-health-nsduh-releases https://www.samhsa.gov/data/release/2021-national-survey-dru... > one only needs to walk the streets of LA So you follow one poor example of evidence with another. There are many confounding factors for why large cities are more likely to have observable population of unhoused and drug abuse, such as availability of services and facilities that treat vulnerable populations and the habit of smaller cities to ship their vulnerable populations to these areas. Let's not forget stagnant wages and disproportionate increases to the cost of living and lack of housing. Decriminalization also means we're not hiding away this vulnerable population by stuffing them in jails and treating the justice system as a half-assed mental health solution. Let's also not forget that the Greater Los Angeles area has a population equal to the states of Washington, Oregon, Idaho, Montana, and Utah combined. > Free access to fent, heroin, crack, cocaine, lsd, meth, and even mdma How do you jump from decriminalization to free drugs? What a silly attempt at a straw man.
- corethree 3y ago
  In other words is the sky blue?
Melting_Harps 3y ago
> Do you live in california? Go outside and open your eyes for evidence. Not any more, but I was born there (multi-generational too) and visit often: I can assure you homelessness has been an issue long before either medical MJ or recreational legislation reforn; the massive effort the US states go to bus their undesirables is well documented [0] and a much larger reason for your 'evidence.' Skid row was arguably a direct byproduct of the Reagan era defunding of mental institutions, and I've come across anecdotal evidence that a large cohort was caused after releasing the broken and hapless former Japanese prisoners in internment camps during WW2: a Japanese colleague of mine found out her paternal grandmother spent time there for years (after she passed) while trying to find her biological family as an adult after having been adopted as a child. And guess what helped her get over this trauma and declining mental health issues? Psilocybin and MDMA and a caring partner that tried to be there for her. 0: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/20/bussed-out-america-moves-homeless-people-country-study https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/...
- corethree 3y ago
  I was born here and I've lived here all my life. I still live here.
  - Melting_Harps 3y ago
    > I was born here and I've lived here all my life. I still live here. Your point? I'm here visiting right now, too. My point was that this State has always had a myriad of issues at any given time, but thinking MJ legalization and decriminalization led to all of this is absurd. I'm from SoCal and I recommend you go watch footage from the late 80s in LA during the crack epidemic, I lived through that as a child; LA country was ground zero for gang violence and crack is and remains illegal. The 90s were only slightly better, despite my nostalgia I'm well aware bank heists made the National news, as did the LA riots, and then the highly emblematic of SoCal culture high speed car chase that still gets people to watch the news to this day. CA has never been a safe place, we have to be tough to live through cycles of drought/earthquake/crime-waves/fires for generations and if you were born here, you'd already know that: these transplants have been deluded by Hollywood into thinking otherwise and think homelessness is a recent phenomenon because Joe Rogan, Elon and his cohort of influencers fled to Texas. Only to realize Texas is a much bigger s**hole than they anticipated with way more homelessness than they were promised. There was a recent article posted here that tech workers and companies are regretting leaving CA because how things have played out in Texas and it's 'good old boy' way of doing things, it's still the South after all: what did you expect?! You have to be a fool to think they were going to tolerate the SV 'woke' culture outside of Austin? Sidenote: The compassion act made MJ legal since the 90s, and it was incredibly easy to get a medical/red card (I had one without even being a resident of CA anymore while living in CO); I actually preferred that over recreational for reasons I won't explain here, and I can assure you beer was harder to get in the early 2000s as a HS student than high-grade MJ was.