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There's a difference, at least to me, about changing standards in language (which, as outsiders to particular communities can seem arbitrary and capricious-- wa

There's a difference, at least to me, about changing standards in language (which, as outsiders to particular communities can seem arbitrary and capricious-- wait a minute, "Queer is OK to say again?" and how is "person of color" materially different from "Colored person") and things like brazen workplace hostility as described in the original blog post. A lot of being actively offensive is more than just the specific words you use but more about what you say with those words. Even if you don't use any dangerous words, when the content of your message is sexist and demeaning such as "Oop, Katie's got the low cut dress on today! I know where I'm sitting!" that's where the offense is. Telling someone to knock that shit off doesn't make us insufferably bland PC thought police, it makes us civilized human beings.

mhartl 15y ago
"Oop, Katie's got the low cut dress on today! I know where I'm sitting!" I can easily imagine a world in which such a remark is routinely interpreted as a compliment. I can also imagine a world in which it is routinely considered offensive. The problem is that we live in a world where you can't easily determine a priori what will be considered "offensive", due in large part to a social convention that says: the victim is always right. This attitude was exemplified by a black University of Wisconsin student who objected to the word "niggardly" (which means "stingy"): "I was in tears, shaking," she told the faculty. "It's not up to the rest of the class to decide whether my feelings are valid."* Political reality makes it exceedingly difficult to draw a line in the sand and say: Your taking offense is what's unreasonable. Stop being such a baby, grow a thicker skin, and lighten up. Absent such a line, the list of "offensive" things grows without bound. * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_%22niggardly%22 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_%2... In this case, her complaint helped serve to smash the university's speech code, but this type of outcome is the exception rather than the rule.
- MartinCron 15y ago
  The "niggardly" example is cute, as is not being able to use "oriental" to describe John Cho's ancestry (he's Korean). I think that they serve as a distraction to the actual issue at hand, though. The actual issue at hand is that "lighten up" is such an obvious response, but it's usually not actually helpful. The problem is that we live in a world where you can't easily determine a priori what will be considered "offensive" That's only a problem if you're not secure enough to handle feedback on your behavior. The original article is all about how she wants to be able to address these very real slights so that people can know what to do (or what not to do) next time. What happens when she gives the specific feedback of telling people what not to do? They respond with the classic bullying tactic of telling her to grow a thick skin. So, you make a mistake and offend somebody, fortunately that's not a capital offense. You get to continue living and learn not to say bullshit sexist things and learn how to be a real adult. Easy.

mhartl 15y ago

"Oop, Katie's got the low cut dress on today! I know where I'm sitting!" I can easily imagine a world in which such a remark is routinely interpreted as a compliment. I can also imagine a world in which it is routinely considered offensive. The problem is that we live in a world where you can't easily determine a priori what will be considered "offensive", due in large part to a social convention that says: the victim is always right. This attitude was exemplified by a black University of Wisconsin student who objected to the word "niggardly" (which means "stingy"): "I was in tears, shaking," she told the faculty. "It's not up to the rest of the class to decide whether my feelings are valid."* Political reality makes it exceedingly difficult to draw a line in the sand and say: Your taking offense is what's unreasonable. Stop being such a baby, grow a thicker skin, and lighten up. Absent such a line, the list of "offensive" things grows without bound. * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_%22niggardly%22 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controversies_about_the_word_%2... In this case, her complaint helped serve to smash the university's speech code, but this type of outcome is the exception rather than the rule.

MartinCron 15y ago
The "niggardly" example is cute, as is not being able to use "oriental" to describe John Cho's ancestry (he's Korean). I think that they serve as a distraction to the actual issue at hand, though. The actual issue at hand is that "lighten up" is such an obvious response, but it's usually not actually helpful. The problem is that we live in a world where you can't easily determine a priori what will be considered "offensive" That's only a problem if you're not secure enough to handle feedback on your behavior. The original article is all about how she wants to be able to address these very real slights so that people can know what to do (or what not to do) next time. What happens when she gives the specific feedback of telling people what not to do? They respond with the classic bullying tactic of telling her to grow a thick skin. So, you make a mistake and offend somebody, fortunately that's not a capital offense. You get to continue living and learn not to say bullshit sexist things and learn how to be a real adult. Easy.