2 ms·

By specifically calling out prayer the order does ban prayer... In that case the woman was arrested for silently praying by herself. Her prayer was to stop the

by sjducb 3y ago

By specifically calling out prayer the order does ban prayer... In that case the woman was arrested for silently praying by herself. Her prayer was to stop the abortion clinic, but it was silent and in her own head. I understand that the intent of the law is to ban prayer near an abortion clinic to stop harassment, but they have banned prayer. (I support everything else in that order, I’m pro choice. I just don’t think we should ban prayer)

pcrh 3y ago
She would have been guilty of harassment even if she were not praying. Edit, these pictures show that "silently praying" is not an unobtrusive as it sounds: https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article23793309.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/0_image-9.jpg https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article2379330... https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article23793310.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/0_robert-clinic-protest.jpg https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article2379331...
- sjducb 3y ago
  Is silent prayer illegal outside some abortion clinics in the UK? Has the UK banned some prayer and arrested at least one person for thought crime? The answer to both of those questions is yes. It’s not about whether she would have been convicted for something else anyway.
  - pcrh 3y ago
    Any form of harassment is illegal. See the pics I posted in an edit above; the protestors make their opinions clear to visitors to the clinic, even while being silent.
    - deleted 3y ago
      [deleted]
    - sjducb 3y ago
      Do you agree that the UK has banned some silent prayer? Do you think it is right that silent prayer was banned in this case? This whole discussion started because people from other countries didn’t believe that the UK would ban silent prayer.
      - growse 3y ago
        > Do you agree that the UK has banned some silent prayer? This is true in the same sense that the UK has also banned breathing, because murdering people is illegal and some people happen to be breathing whilst doing their murdering.
      - flir 3y ago
        Pretty sure I could walk through that area while praying and not get arrested. I'd do it by making no outward signs that I was praying. Therefore, prayer is not banned. Also pretty sure I could get arrested in that area by kneeling on the pavement and meditating, rather than praying. I don't think "but I was meditating" would cut it as a defence, either, because what's banned is "anything that looks like protest, here are some examples". I think it's the kneeling she got arrested for, which happens to be coded as "prayer" in our culture. In other words, she was arrested for protesting.
growse 3y ago
If she was "silently praying by herself" in her own house, or literally most other places in the country, she wouldn't have been arrested. The context matters.

by sjducb 3y ago

pcrh 3y ago

She would have been guilty of harassment even if she were not praying. Edit, these pictures show that "silently praying" is not an unobtrusive as it sounds: https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article23793309.ece/ALTERNATES/s810/0_image-9.jpg https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article2379330... https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article23793310.ece/ALTERNATES/s615b/0_robert-clinic-protest.jpg https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/incoming/article2379331...

sjducb 3y ago
Is silent prayer illegal outside some abortion clinics in the UK? Has the UK banned some prayer and arrested at least one person for thought crime? The answer to both of those questions is yes. It’s not about whether she would have been convicted for something else anyway.
- pcrh 3y ago
  Any form of harassment is illegal. See the pics I posted in an edit above; the protestors make their opinions clear to visitors to the clinic, even while being silent.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - sjducb 3y ago
    Do you agree that the UK has banned some silent prayer? Do you think it is right that silent prayer was banned in this case? This whole discussion started because people from other countries didn’t believe that the UK would ban silent prayer.
    - growse 3y ago
      > Do you agree that the UK has banned some silent prayer? This is true in the same sense that the UK has also banned breathing, because murdering people is illegal and some people happen to be breathing whilst doing their murdering.
    - flir 3y ago
      Pretty sure I could walk through that area while praying and not get arrested. I'd do it by making no outward signs that I was praying. Therefore, prayer is not banned. Also pretty sure I could get arrested in that area by kneeling on the pavement and meditating, rather than praying. I don't think "but I was meditating" would cut it as a defence, either, because what's banned is "anything that looks like protest, here are some examples". I think it's the kneeling she got arrested for, which happens to be coded as "prayer" in our culture. In other words, she was arrested for protesting.

growse 3y ago

If she was "silently praying by herself" in her own house, or literally most other places in the country, she wouldn't have been arrested. The context matters.