5 ms·

I don't know where you live, but in most Western countries the capital required to become a business owner (i.e. start a legal business entity) is within reach

by alvah 3y ago

I don't know where you live, but in most Western countries the capital required to become a business owner (i.e. start a legal business entity) is within reach of most people.

michaelmrose 3y ago
Unless we are talking about the money to file the paperwork to instantiate such an entity this just isn't true at least in the US. Lets examine the parameters. In order to start a new business one has to be able to cover startup costs and live on your savings. Lets look at average savings as a starting point. https://www.zippia.com/advice/american-savings-statistics/ https://www.zippia.com/advice/american-savings-statistics/ About 33% have 10,000+ and 42% have less than 1000. Even 10k is really very little in truth just a little runway until you can either acquire additional funding or crash and burn. Lets inject some reality. Half of America has basically nothing. Another 25% would have to sink the majority of their accumulated wealth eg home equity into such an endeavor with a 50 50 chance of existing in 5 years. They COULD do it but it would be both scary and dangerous and half of them would end up ruined. It's like saying I could climb Everest. I could scrape up the funds for the plane ticket and its possible I might survive the trip but anyone saying "most people could climb Everest" would be talking nonsense.
- alvah 3y ago
  “and live on your savings.” << this is an obvious strawman. There are plenty of ways to start a business without instantly giving up other employment.
  - michaelmrose 3y ago
    To be quite frank this is mostly bullshit. Few people in the majority could live on less than full time hours or successfully launch a new endeavor on less. The counter examples mostly involve the "business" of owning things. For example owning the house someone else lives in especially if the day to day affairs are managed by a property manager, or investing in an endeavor wherein the majority of the work is done by those slightly less privileged wherein the "work" is effectively giving direction to secure your investment.
    - alvah 3y ago
      -“To be quite frank this mostly bullshit” -some ramble about how it’s all too hard Excellent debating style right there!
      - michaelmrose 3y ago
        You dismissed the meat of the argument. People have finite amounts of time and money. In present context households are already running full tilt usually with 2 full time workers just to stay in one spot with too little in reserve to even cover ordinary disasters. It is this surplus of time and money that creates the opportunity for exciting things to happen like starting a small businesses. Increasing costs and inequality rob us of the future surpluses that would be produced by such endeavors. Should we want to enrich our society it isn't sufficient to pretend opportunity exists we just endeavor to actually support it.
        alvah 3y ago
        "You dismissed" - what, by calling it mostly bullshit? The rest of your response is similar to your previous rambles about how it's all too hard, despite the countless examples, a mere google search away, of people who have started and run businesses in Western countries without instantly starving to death, or whatever your mostly-bullshit argument is.
        michaelmrose 3y ago
        So say you are liquid for 1000 bucks with average credit and a 50 hour a week time commitment to working and commuting to earn just enough to get by. This or worse is about half the country You need expertise, time, and money to start a business. The majority of people lack not one but all 3. This is probably why only 9% own an established business. Indeed jp Morgan says that future business owners on average start out substantially wealthier. https://www.jpmorganchase.com/institute/research/small-business/small-business-ownership-liquid-wealth-startup-exit#finding-1 https://www.jpmorganchase.com/institute/research/small-busin... Which supports my assertion that the majority are ill positioned to start a business. Money buys time, money buys relevant expertise in, wealth makes risk tenable because failure doesn't mean homelessness, money and financial health in fact buys access to borrowed money. Everyone could just do what only 9% of people do is an incredibly privileged thing to say it's like Zuckerberg saying anyone can have a website or bolt saying anyone can run. It's insulting.

by alvah 3y ago

I don't know where you live, but in most Western countries the capital required to become a business owner (i.e. start a legal business entity) is within reach of most people.

michaelmrose 3y ago

Unless we are talking about the money to file the paperwork to instantiate such an entity this just isn't true at least in the US. Lets examine the parameters. In order to start a new business one has to be able to cover startup costs and live on your savings. Lets look at average savings as a starting point. https://www.zippia.com/advice/american-savings-statistics/ https://www.zippia.com/advice/american-savings-statistics/ About 33% have 10,000+ and 42% have less than 1000. Even 10k is really very little in truth just a little runway until you can either acquire additional funding or crash and burn. Lets inject some reality. Half of America has basically nothing. Another 25% would have to sink the majority of their accumulated wealth eg home equity into such an endeavor with a 50 50 chance of existing in 5 years. They COULD do it but it would be both scary and dangerous and half of them would end up ruined. It's like saying I could climb Everest. I could scrape up the funds for the plane ticket and its possible I might survive the trip but anyone saying "most people could climb Everest" would be talking nonsense.

alvah 3y ago
“and live on your savings.” << this is an obvious strawman. There are plenty of ways to start a business without instantly giving up other employment.
- michaelmrose 3y ago
  To be quite frank this is mostly bullshit. Few people in the majority could live on less than full time hours or successfully launch a new endeavor on less. The counter examples mostly involve the "business" of owning things. For example owning the house someone else lives in especially if the day to day affairs are managed by a property manager, or investing in an endeavor wherein the majority of the work is done by those slightly less privileged wherein the "work" is effectively giving direction to secure your investment.
  - alvah 3y ago
    -“To be quite frank this mostly bullshit” -some ramble about how it’s all too hard Excellent debating style right there!
    - michaelmrose 3y ago
      You dismissed the meat of the argument. People have finite amounts of time and money. In present context households are already running full tilt usually with 2 full time workers just to stay in one spot with too little in reserve to even cover ordinary disasters. It is this surplus of time and money that creates the opportunity for exciting things to happen like starting a small businesses. Increasing costs and inequality rob us of the future surpluses that would be produced by such endeavors. Should we want to enrich our society it isn't sufficient to pretend opportunity exists we just endeavor to actually support it.
      - alvah 3y ago
        "You dismissed" - what, by calling it mostly bullshit? The rest of your response is similar to your previous rambles about how it's all too hard, despite the countless examples, a mere google search away, of people who have started and run businesses in Western countries without instantly starving to death, or whatever your mostly-bullshit argument is.
        michaelmrose 3y ago
        So say you are liquid for 1000 bucks with average credit and a 50 hour a week time commitment to working and commuting to earn just enough to get by. This or worse is about half the country You need expertise, time, and money to start a business. The majority of people lack not one but all 3. This is probably why only 9% own an established business. Indeed jp Morgan says that future business owners on average start out substantially wealthier. https://www.jpmorganchase.com/institute/research/small-business/small-business-ownership-liquid-wealth-startup-exit#finding-1 https://www.jpmorganchase.com/institute/research/small-busin... Which supports my assertion that the majority are ill positioned to start a business. Money buys time, money buys relevant expertise in, wealth makes risk tenable because failure doesn't mean homelessness, money and financial health in fact buys access to borrowed money. Everyone could just do what only 9% of people do is an incredibly privileged thing to say it's like Zuckerberg saying anyone can have a website or bolt saying anyone can run. It's insulting.