4 ms·
If you're interested in the grammar, I think the distinction you're getting at is pluperfect (plan action that was completed-in-the-past-in-the-past) and perfec
by benrutter 3y ago
If you're interested in the grammar, I think the distinction you're getting at is pluperfect (plan action that was completed-in-the-past-in-the-past) and perfect (an action that was completed-in-the-past).
"She had said goodbye too many times before" means, at some point in the past, it was the case that she had previously said goodbye too many times. I think this is the intended meaning.
"She said goodbye too many times before" I don't think makes sense if you're extremely literal about it, since I can't see what "before" would track to without the embedded past.
The grammatically correct versions I can come up with are:
- She had (or she'd) said goodbye too many times before.
- She said goodbye too many times.
- She said, "Goodbye too many times before".
Disclaimer: I do get that these are all worse song lyrics and that nobody had any problem understanding the intended meaning of the example sentence, which is sort of the goal of grammar.
- Majromax 3y ago> "She said goodbye too many times before" I don't think makes sense if you're extremely literal about it, since I can't see what "before" would track to without the embedded past. It would grammatically work if you interpreted 'said' as a habitual action. "Before [the etiquette training], she said 'goodbye' too many times. [Now, she says it just once.]" In the context of the song, I think the habitual interpretation makes sense; the lyrics speak of trying to break the pattern of a dysfunctional relationship. This also works in that "said goodbye" has figurative intent (meaning 'left the relationship') over its literal meaning of verbally expressing one's departure.
- hgsgm 3y agoI don't think that matches. In your version, "before" implies that something happened that affected the goodbye-saying. In the song, "before" is an adverb referring to the current time in the story, which does not impact the goodbye-saying. I can only make yours scan if I interpret it as "She said goodbye too many times before... I stopped taking her back.
- jakear 3y agoSomehow the context of the song hasn't been shared on the thread yet: Whispered goodbye as she got on a plane Never to return again ... This love has taken its toll on me She said goodbye too many times before And her heart is breaking in front of me And I have no choice 'cause I won't say goodbye anymore Clearly "before" is needed to rhyme with "anymore". Also it is referencing the times she said "goodbye" before she said it this last time when she got on the plane.
- eszed 3y agoThanks for the context, as I'm not familiar with that song. Isn't the grammatically correct rendering of that line "she _has_ said goodbye too many times before"? (Present Perfect, right?) Now I'm curious to hear the recording: is there a sibilant, "she's"? Edit: Several others made the same point below. I'll leave this here, but they were first. /e
- jakear 3y agoThere's no audible difference between signing "she's said" and "she said", the s's blend together. Any possible difference would be entirely obscured by stylistic choices. Even vocalizing normally the difference is hard to tell. Try saying "She said I love you" vs "She's said I love you" – unless you make a point to completely stop in between words there's basically zero distinction.
- eszed 3y agoYou're right, and I thought of that about an hour after I'd posted that comment. D'oh!