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As a developer and a consumer, what I'd really like to see is: - Manufacturer voluntary guarantee of 1/3/5 years security updates with an expiration date. - S

As a developer and a consumer, what I'd really like to see is: - Manufacturer voluntary guarantee of 1/3/5 years security updates with an expiration date. - Separation of functionality and security updates. - The ability to "turn off" connectivity and retain full local functionality. - An industry security certification like UL. - A single point way of identifying and validating devices. As it is, I avoid using IoT mostly for security reasons. Having worked in security for many years I have seen the best and the worst. Having security isn't a panacea either - it needs an ongoing management & reporting infrastructure.

thfuran 3y ago
>-The ability to "turn off" connectivity and retain full local functionality. >- An industry security certification like UL. I don't think those should be separated. UL is about safety and, while insecurity is roughly the software equivalent of a device's propensity to suddenly catch fire, reliability is also an important part of safety in all but the most frivolous applications, and local functionality is an important consideration for reliability.
- TeMPOraL 3y ago
  Nest thermostat being one example, but myself I'm very happy I have IR remotes to the A/C at home, because I wouldn't want to be unable to turn on the cooling during one of the recent heatwaves over in Europe, just because Internet is down and the control app can't connect to the damn cloud. (Not that I mind networking in general. Operating those A/C units via Home Assistant app is a glorious and pleasant experience - entirely unlike the vendor's official app.)
AnthonyMouse 3y ago
> Manufacturer voluntary guarantee of 1/3/5 years security updates with an expiration date. I just have to point out that these are all extraordinarily short numbers. There are industrial control systems that are still in operation despite being made out of mechanical relays from before the advent of microprocessors. We got used to electronics getting replaced every 3-5 years because if it's a laptop by then it will be considered slow and have a questionable battery. But these devices are now being permanently affixed to real estate. We need a way to update these devices that will outlive the manufacturers. Because many of the devices will.
- hunter2_ 3y ago
  > these devices are now being permanently affixed to real estate I predict the NEC will start demanding the use of Wago style splices, no more wire nuts, due to how frequently people are swapping out smart switches and the like. Even non-smart dimmers have been changed multiple times in my residence due to evolving LED compatibility (another "wild west" situation right now). I haven't broken any copper, but the increased likelihood is pretty obvious. Electricians may start seeing more pigtails installed for no other reason than breakage.
  - AnthonyMouse 3y ago
    That's for the people who actually change them out. Then you're going to have the guy who loves Smart Thingies, fills his house with them, and sells it to someone content to use the Smart Switch as a switch and the Smart Stove as a stove even if they're >10 years old and none of the smart apps are supported anymore. But they're all still sitting there soliciting incoming connections.

thfuran 3y ago

>-The ability to "turn off" connectivity and retain full local functionality. >- An industry security certification like UL. I don't think those should be separated. UL is about safety and, while insecurity is roughly the software equivalent of a device's propensity to suddenly catch fire, reliability is also an important part of safety in all but the most frivolous applications, and local functionality is an important consideration for reliability.

TeMPOraL 3y ago
Nest thermostat being one example, but myself I'm very happy I have IR remotes to the A/C at home, because I wouldn't want to be unable to turn on the cooling during one of the recent heatwaves over in Europe, just because Internet is down and the control app can't connect to the damn cloud. (Not that I mind networking in general. Operating those A/C units via Home Assistant app is a glorious and pleasant experience - entirely unlike the vendor's official app.)

AnthonyMouse 3y ago

> Manufacturer voluntary guarantee of 1/3/5 years security updates with an expiration date. I just have to point out that these are all extraordinarily short numbers. There are industrial control systems that are still in operation despite being made out of mechanical relays from before the advent of microprocessors. We got used to electronics getting replaced every 3-5 years because if it's a laptop by then it will be considered slow and have a questionable battery. But these devices are now being permanently affixed to real estate. We need a way to update these devices that will outlive the manufacturers. Because many of the devices will.

hunter2_ 3y ago
> these devices are now being permanently affixed to real estate I predict the NEC will start demanding the use of Wago style splices, no more wire nuts, due to how frequently people are swapping out smart switches and the like. Even non-smart dimmers have been changed multiple times in my residence due to evolving LED compatibility (another "wild west" situation right now). I haven't broken any copper, but the increased likelihood is pretty obvious. Electricians may start seeing more pigtails installed for no other reason than breakage.
- AnthonyMouse 3y ago
  That's for the people who actually change them out. Then you're going to have the guy who loves Smart Thingies, fills his house with them, and sells it to someone content to use the Smart Switch as a switch and the Smart Stove as a stove even if they're >10 years old and none of the smart apps are supported anymore. But they're all still sitting there soliciting incoming connections.