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> I'm sure my comment will trigger negatively a ton of developers, because talking about JS like this it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult. Just FYI th

> I'm sure my comment will trigger negatively a ton of developers, because talking about JS like this it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult. Just FYI this line of argument is called “poisoning the well”. Definition from Wikipedia: > a type of informal fallacy where adverse information about a target is preemptively presented to an audience, with the intention of discrediting or ridiculing something that the target person is about to say. It is not conductive to a reasoned discourse about a technical topic.

fluoridation 3y ago
That's not poisoning the well. That would be something like "if you disagree with this it's because you've drunk the kool-aid of the web development cult, so your opinion is biased and therefore invalid". Something along those lines. Although it was poorly phrased, what GP meant to say is that they weren't trying to intentionally offend anyone's sensibilities, they were just expressing their sincere opinion on a subject.
- dleary 3y ago
  “Triggered” implies an emotional or irrational overreaction to some stimulus. Describing your opponents as a “cult” also implies that they are non rational. The GP described opposition to his argument, before it was presented, as coming from triggered members of a cult. If this is not poisoning the well, what changes to his argument need to be present for it to cross over the line? How much more clear does it need to be?
  - lelanthran 3y ago
    > The GP described opposition to his argument, before it was presented, as coming from triggered members of a cult. And to rub salt into the wound, he then went on to describe his preference as "the most correct". I wonder what he primarily programs in.
    - ivanmontillam 3y ago
      > I wonder what he primarily programs in. Let me dissipate your wonderance. I started my programming life with Delphi and C++ (pre-C++11), and when Delphi IDE became too bloated, I jumped to Python 3.x and didn't take it too seriously until Python 3.6 onwards.
      - lelanthran 3y ago
        Python? But it's got all the same footguns that JS has, with fewer features. If you're used to those footguns, why are you complaining about JS?
      - gloryjulio 3y ago
        Python is even worse than than js. Worse package management, worst static typing feature. I also work in cpp space and I would rank large python code base one the worst to read with
  - fluoridation 3y ago
    It's not about crossing a line. For it to be poisoning the well it would need to have a characteristic that it simply doesn't have. At no point does the comment attempt to present its detractor's opinions as inherently invalid or worthy of less consideration.
    - bazoom42 3y ago
      It suggests they are reacting negatively because they are in a cult.
      - fluoridation 3y ago
        What it literally says is "it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult". It's not a very idiomatic sentence, which to me suggests the writer is not a native English speaker, so we need to interpret more liberally. >my comment will trigger negatively a ton of developers, because talking about JS like this it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult. Let me be clear this is not my intention. The salient points are: * A lot of developer may take offense to these comments. * "Because it's like I've insulted a cult" -> "Because it's like I'm killing the sacred cow." -> "Because it's like I'm trying to be intentionally offensive about something that's off-limits." * This is not their intention. If you take into account the entire paragraph I think the intent is quite clear. "If you take offense to my comments please keep in mind that I'm not trying to be intentionally offensive, I'm just expressing my personal opinion." I'll grant you that it's somewhat clumsily communicated, but that's not that surprising if ivanmontillam is not a native speaker. I think you latched on too strongly to specific words, instead of taking in the general message.
        ivanmontillam 3y ago
        Thank you for teaching me better english dear Sir. (I speak natively Spanish)
        fluoridation 3y ago
        No problem. By the way, Spanish is also my first language.

fluoridation 3y ago

That's not poisoning the well. That would be something like "if you disagree with this it's because you've drunk the kool-aid of the web development cult, so your opinion is biased and therefore invalid". Something along those lines. Although it was poorly phrased, what GP meant to say is that they weren't trying to intentionally offend anyone's sensibilities, they were just expressing their sincere opinion on a subject.

dleary 3y ago
“Triggered” implies an emotional or irrational overreaction to some stimulus. Describing your opponents as a “cult” also implies that they are non rational. The GP described opposition to his argument, before it was presented, as coming from triggered members of a cult. If this is not poisoning the well, what changes to his argument need to be present for it to cross over the line? How much more clear does it need to be?
- lelanthran 3y ago
  > The GP described opposition to his argument, before it was presented, as coming from triggered members of a cult. And to rub salt into the wound, he then went on to describe his preference as "the most correct". I wonder what he primarily programs in.
  - ivanmontillam 3y ago
    > I wonder what he primarily programs in. Let me dissipate your wonderance. I started my programming life with Delphi and C++ (pre-C++11), and when Delphi IDE became too bloated, I jumped to Python 3.x and didn't take it too seriously until Python 3.6 onwards.
    - lelanthran 3y ago
      Python? But it's got all the same footguns that JS has, with fewer features. If you're used to those footguns, why are you complaining about JS?
    - gloryjulio 3y ago
      Python is even worse than than js. Worse package management, worst static typing feature. I also work in cpp space and I would rank large python code base one the worst to read with
- fluoridation 3y ago
  It's not about crossing a line. For it to be poisoning the well it would need to have a characteristic that it simply doesn't have. At no point does the comment attempt to present its detractor's opinions as inherently invalid or worthy of less consideration.
  - bazoom42 3y ago
    It suggests they are reacting negatively because they are in a cult.
    - fluoridation 3y ago
      What it literally says is "it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult". It's not a very idiomatic sentence, which to me suggests the writer is not a native English speaker, so we need to interpret more liberally. >my comment will trigger negatively a ton of developers, because talking about JS like this it's going to feel like I've insulted a cult. Let me be clear this is not my intention. The salient points are: * A lot of developer may take offense to these comments. * "Because it's like I've insulted a cult" -> "Because it's like I'm killing the sacred cow." -> "Because it's like I'm trying to be intentionally offensive about something that's off-limits." * This is not their intention. If you take into account the entire paragraph I think the intent is quite clear. "If you take offense to my comments please keep in mind that I'm not trying to be intentionally offensive, I'm just expressing my personal opinion." I'll grant you that it's somewhat clumsily communicated, but that's not that surprising if ivanmontillam is not a native speaker. I think you latched on too strongly to specific words, instead of taking in the general message.
      - ivanmontillam 3y ago
        Thank you for teaching me better english dear Sir. (I speak natively Spanish)
        fluoridation 3y ago
        No problem. By the way, Spanish is also my first language.