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Most Americans only know pad thai, but pad gaprao is where it's at, especially pad gaprao kai dao (with a fried egg that has a runny yolk). It's not that easy
by wenc 3y ago
Most Americans only know pad thai, but pad gaprao is where it's at, especially pad gaprao kai dao (with a fried egg that has a runny yolk).
It's not that easy to replicate because of its main ingredient: holy basil. This is not normal basil or Thai basil. Holy basil is a specific kind of basil that tastes peppery and is not commonly available in the U.S. (but grows like weeds in Thailand).
It is an iconic dish in Thailand. When food vlogger Mark Wiens opened his first restaurant PhedMark, he choose to specialize in pad gaprao and nothing else because it was the national staple.
BEFRS review here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3ticHfFo2Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G3ticHfFo2Q
- sirn 3y agoI would also suggest OTR's video on the topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OupK3x8ujw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OupK3x8ujw which also covers the importance of Holy Basil, talks about other variants of Pad Krapao that are little known outside of Thailand, and also a little bit of the history behind the dish.
- resolutebat 3y agoBit of an irrelevant aside, but it's amazing(ly sad) how off the wall Thai romanization remains. In Thai the dish is of course unambiguously ผัดกะเพรา, where the "correct" RTGS romanization would be "phat kaphrao". Yet the Guardian randomly uses only the second half of this, subbing in "pad" for the first word even though ผ and พ are pronounced identically. Whereas you're at least consistent in using for lack of a better word "backpacker Thai", where ก/พ are g/p instead of k/ph and ด is written d even when it's pronounced t (as in ผัด). Anyway! If you need a decent {ph,p}a{t,d} {k,g}ap{h}rao and are not in Thailand, I can warmly recommend Greyhound Cafe, which has branches in Singapore, Hong Kong, Manila and London: https://www.greyhoundcafe.co.th/ https://www.greyhoundcafe.co.th/
- biztos 3y agoAlso, the “r” in that position is silent colloquially, so enjoy your pad gapao!
- kanwisher 3y agono there are multiple writing of Grapao in Thai, some have the extra R and some don't, it goes back a 100 years when the spelling wasn't commonized
- biztos 3y agoI don’t mean the spelling, I mean that the “r” in that case is not spoken, presumably because saying it as “l” would be inconvenient. But really, are any of them “grapao” with the r on the first syllable? I always thought that was just a mistake we foreigners make because we don’t learn it as กะเพรา.
- robga 3y agoGreyhound London? This matched my experience - fusion confusion. https://www.standard.co.uk/reveller/restaurants/greyhound-cafe-review-katie-glass-gets-lost-in-the-fusion-confusion-a3760366.html https://www.standard.co.uk/reveller/restaurants/greyhound-ca...
- petesergeant 3y agoThe Heron in London is very very good
- resolutebat 3y agoThey have a large menu with lots of Western choices too (because that's hip for Thai people in Thailand), but I've never been disappointed with the pure Thai side of the menu. YMMV, and I haven't been to the London branch.
- wingerlang 3y ago> where ก/พ are g/p instead of k/ph I'll die on this hill but ก as g is clearly a more accurate than k. Like, you wouldn't pronounce ไก่ as "kai" (ไข่/ไหค่/etc) it's so much more clear to say "gai(lowtone)". Point being that even the official romanization sucks.
- jdtig 3y agoYou think that /k/ sounds like /g/, because you speak a language (English) that doesn't distinguish them. However, I imagine that writing "k" for /k/ makes perfect sense to speakers of languages that have /g/, /k/, and /kh/. And your solution works for /k/ and /kh/, but runs into problems when you have a three-way contrast (/b/p/ph/ and /d/t/th). You can't write "buu" for "crab" just because you think it sounds like an English "b"; you need "b" for the actual /b/ sound.
- wingerlang 3y agoI just think that ไก่ is miles closer to Gai than Kai, that's all. Another hill would be that ปู is best written as bpuu/bpoo. I don't really think it matters, no one is consistent, no transliteration covers all cases. Unless maybe ipa? (which no one uses to communicate anyway).
- jdtig 3y agoI can agree that the Paiboon romanization (g/k, b/bp/b, d/dt/t) is probably the most intuitive for English-speakers. But it's silly to say that it's the best system just because it is easiest for people like yourself. I do think something IPA-inspired (k/kh, b/p/ph, d/t/th) is consistent and still usable. It will also encourage better pronunciation (at least for somewhat serious students) if they are trying to say the correct sound (unaspirated /k/) instead of approximating it with an English phoneme that isn't used in Thai (voiced /g/).
- wingerlang 3y agoI didn't say it is the best system though, I said that I think some characters are more accurate than others. The implied context being, casually writing Thai in English, to other English speakers. But I do think that an intuitive system is better than an IPA inspired system, and that's purely because of the fact that only 1% of people will be using it and understanding it. The other 99% will be using other, random, variations. However an intuitive system will at least catch most people who speaks English. Any romanization that is more than "close enough" is a waste of time though, when compared to simply learning to write in Thai.
- thaiman 3y agoActually it all have to do with aspiration, e.g a small puff of air coming out when saying the sound. Or in the case with ก , it is a k without any air coming out is probably the most accurate description but writing g is therefore closer then a real k that have aspiration. :) You can test this yourself with holding your hand in front of your mouth saying english k and then stop any air from coming out. There you have the correct sound for ก
- FabHK 3y agoInteresting. I don't know about Thai, but for Mandarin, the issue is similar - g/k, d/t, b/p in English all are (voiced and unaspirated) or (unvoiced and aspirated), while what's in Pinyin denoted g/k, d/t, b/p is (unvoiced and unaspirated) or (unvoiced and aspirated). In other words, if you put the 4 combinations in a square, in English (and German), 2 are used that are on a diagonal, while in Mandarin, 2 are used that are in the same row (or column, as the case may be). In Hindi apparently are 4 are used. ETA: Wikipedia says this: "Between pairs of stops or affricates having the same place of articulation and manner of articulation, the primary distinction is not voiced vs. voiceless (as in French or Russian), but unaspirated vs. aspirated (as in Scottish Gaelic or Icelandic)." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Chinese_phonology#Consonants https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_Chinese_phonology#Con...
- FabHK 3y agoCan second Greyhound. Hungry now...
- SPBS 3y agoI can see why they did it, 'phat kaphrao' might be mispronounced as 'fat kaphrao' ('phat' being the stylistic way of spelling fat on the internet).
- xnorswap 3y agoIt's not an internet thing, "Ph" is pronounced like F almost everywhere in English, e.g. "Gopher" or "Phone". It makes little sense to transliterate a non "F" sound to Ph. ( And apparently this practice has roots from the even older transliteration of Phi )
- psunavy03 3y agoI'm in greater Seattle so maybe I'm biased, but holy basil is available in Asian groceries from time to time, you just have to go looking and jump on it when you find it. Otherwise, Amazon has seeds to grow your own, so if you like phad ka prow (which I do), this is not on the same level as world peace.
- wenc 3y agoYou can get holy basil at Mekong Market on Rainier. You definitely can't find it at Fred Meyer or Safeway or QFC; you can't even find it at Asian Family Mart. If there's a will, there's a way of course, but lack of easy sourcing means friction, and friction means not all Thai restaurants in the US will have it on their menu. I would be surprised if a Thai restaurant in Des Moines, Iowa served pad gaprao, whereas pad thai is universal at all US Thai restaurants.
- taurath 3y agoThanks for the tip! I’ve been growing my own but when I’m out I’d love to get more.
- fuzztester 3y agoThe holy basil plant is called tulasi in Hindi and some other Indian languages. Ocimum tenuiflorum: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ocimum_tenuiflorum https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ocimum_tenuiflorum It is widespread across India, both as a weed and grown in houses, gardens and temples, and there is a lot of religious and cultural stuff around it. Edit: it is also supposed to have some medicinal value, so is added to herbal teas along with other common spices like ginger, turmeric, pepper, cardamom, clove, cinammon, etc.
- spaceman_2020 3y agoDidn't realize they used Tulsi. I've been using regular Basil instead! Surprising that Tulsi is so rarely used in Indian cooking. When I think about it, fragrant fresh herbs are very seldom used in Indian cooking, outside of coriander (mostly used as garnish). Even mint is used only in certain dishes.
- selimthegrim 3y agoFresh fenugreek (as opposed to dried) is occasionally used in chicken and vegetable dishes. Mint is sometimes used in lentil dishes to punch it up.
- fuzztester 3y ago>occasionally Very regularly, actually. Methi (fenugreek) paratha is popular wherever parathas are, which is large parts of India.
- fuzztester 3y agoAlso see what I said about methi here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37398973 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37398973
- selimthegrim 3y agoAs you said it varies by region. Certainly Kasuri methi (dried) is most commonly used form in Pakistan. You are right about mint chutney but that is condiment.
- wsc981 3y agoThe most delicious Thai meal (with Chinese origins) is in my opinion Kaow Soi Gai. Don’t think it’s easy to get in the Western world at Thai restaurants. Perhaps more of a Northern Thai food.
- petesergeant 3y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khao_soi https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khao_soi Careful ordering it though, as you’ll get plain rice if you don’t get the tone right!
- taurath 3y agoKao Soi is a staple in many Thai restaurants in my city!
- bsimpson 3y agoHang lay curry is from the same region. Also delicious, but much harder to find outside northern Thailand.
- wsc981 3y agoVery delicious as well. Didn’t know the name but Googling the name I recognize the photos. My girlfriend cooks this meal quite often for me (she is Thai and we live in Chiang Mai province).
- bsimpson 3y agoNong Beer in Pai is one of the best known purveyors, but it wasn't as good as I remembered last time I was there.
- spaceman_2020 3y agoSeconded. I could move to Chiang Mai just for this dish.
- silisili 3y agoI used to only order pad thai, but found they vary so much place to place there's a 50/50 shot I'll hate it. Some smother with cilantro, and I'm on of those weird anti cilantro people. Some use a peanut sauce. Some use crushed peanuts. Some use whole nuts. Just to name a few variables. I think the worst I had was just rice noodles, cilantro, whole nut pieces, and egg pieces. And that was all. Anymore I find drunken noodles(Thai spicy) pretty reliable. I have no idea if it's even an authentic dish, but it seems more consistent.
- petesergeant 3y ago> but found they vary so much place to place This is true in Thailand too fwiw
- wingerlang 3y agoI'm still sad that my favorite pad thai (-selling restaurant) vanished overnight. They definitely vary a lot, and I also avoid it somewhat for that reason, but when you find one that fits all your requirements it's great.
- fuzztester 3y agoDo they use the immature peanuts or the mature harder ones? Somehow, when used in dishes, I am okay with the former, but don't like the latter. Okay with both for eating plain.
- stOneskull 3y ago> Most Americans only know pad thai, but pad gaprao is where it's at until you discover nam tok
- taurath 3y agoI grow my own holy basil in a hydroponic garden to make proper krapao at home. It’s the dish I miss most from Thailand. I’ve considered making a food blog that rates Thai restaurants by their krapao as I’ve noticed if that dish is good the entire place is usually fantastic. There’s one place close to my home that is just as good or better than I can make, which is high praise, and very dangerous because sometimes I’m lazy and need to have it. Also I’d be remiss to not mention how amazing it is with prik nam pla, a simple spicy umami sour condiment that makes it explode with flavor. And a fried egg, especially if it’s a Thai fried egg. Best dish in the world to me!
- james_pm 3y agoSame. An Aerogarden makes it very easy to grow the stuff all year round. In the summer, I transplant some into the garden as well. It's a weed and before too long I generally have way too much.
- spaceman_2020 3y agoThai food is all around amazing, but man, nothing will top the Khao Soi in northern Thailand. Dirt cheap ($1-$1.5) and absolutely one of the best things I've ever eaten.
- randomcarbloke 3y agoRegular basil will work, it is peppery, especially if fresh and in larger quantities, it obviously isn't the same but it will get you close enough and it still tastes spectacular.
- walmart 3y agoI always get drunken noodles.
- howinteresting 3y agoHoly basil is also known as tulsi, for those who are familiar with Indian traditions.