6 ms·

> Bulstrode hasn’t yet responded to Jelf or Howes in public, but it’s hard to see how her paper can be creditably defended. > I doubt that Bulstrode set out to

by bArray 3y ago

> Bulstrode hasn’t yet responded to Jelf or Howes in public, but it’s hard to see how her paper can be creditably defended. > I doubt that Bulstrode set out to deceive. No, I think she did. If your intentions are good, you would address the concerns and correct the record. Those around her have a _duty_ to strongly encourage her to do so, otherwise they are complicit. > It’s one thing for a young and passionate academic to make mistakes; it’s quite another for a series of experienced academics to let her make them. The reason these other experienced academics are onboard is because it fits a narrative that has involved rewriting history in front of our very eyes. You just need to take a quick look at the language used, it has swallowed academia. To get grants in academia now (particularly in some spaces), you have to justify how it will have some form of social justice impact. The work itself could be completely abstract, but now the results are tainted by the lens you were forced to put on the work in order to receive funding. I am not surprised for example that a University funded a history paper that showed Jamaican metallurgists used ancient black magic, but it was stolen by the evil white man. There are some pockets of academics holding out, but they evaporate quickly. They are leaving academia and receiving a minimum of double salary in the private sector. Expect to see more and more work like this come out of academia, as they replace these people with those who echo the proper narrative to get the grant funding.

throwaway2037 3y ago
They are leaving academia and receiving a minimum of double salary in the private sector. Historians? If so, can you name a few example? I find this hard to believe.
- rightbyte 3y ago
  Good academics don't need to work in their field. Just any generic clerk position will do.
- zztop44 3y ago
  I have a friend who was a historian and now works as a data analyst for a SEO agency and makes more than double their previous salary. They had no particular expertise in SEO or data beyond being able to use Excel and being able to think and write clearly.
- bArray 3y ago
  > Historians? If so, can you name a few example? I find this hard to believe. I was speaking more generally about academics who are under pressure from the current political bias. As other comments have mentioned though, the critical thinking required for good historian work is also quite broadly applicable elsewhere.
- WeylandYutani 3y ago
  In America I can believe it. The US government doesn't fund cultural institutions very much. It's all left to private institutions (who frequently have political and ideological agendas).
  - telotortium 3y ago
    Nah, both public and private universities in the US are pushing this political and ideological agenda. I'm not aware of any systematic pay difference for academics in public vs private universities - for example, Stanford (private) pays similarly to Berkeley (public), and they have similar politics. Both pay much less than private sector for anyone who can get an academic job at one of those institutions. Your comment is a little more applicable to museums and the arts, but the US government funds all universities, both public and private, pretty lavishly. Unfortunately the university administrators have a habit of accruing much of that funding to themselves and leaving the academics relatively little.
stareatgoats 3y ago
I don't think she set out to deceive, and your stated reasons for thinking so don't pan out. I believe the author of the article is right: historians have to be conscious of their narrative or the narrative will write the history. That's not being deceptive in the normal sense of the word, it's catering to a perceived true narrative, and unconsciously suppressing anything that might undermine it. Politicians do it all the time, but historians in particular should not do it. They still do: in this case painting a skewed picture of the ingenious slave, in other cases they might paint a picture of the glorious supremacy of the western civilization. Not getting caught in such narratives is ... difficult.
- bArray 3y ago
  > I don't think she set out to deceive, and your stated reasons for thinking so don't pan out. I believe at this moment in time she is well aware of the claims against her paper. She has not released a rebuttal to the claims, likely because she doesn't have one (otherwise she would have used stronger evidence in her paper). Every day that goes by, she leaves the paper un-adapted and un-retracted, meaning that she knowingly propagates this false narrative. It is likely she has zero intention of retracting her paper unless the journal forces her. > Politicians do it all the time, but historians in particular should not do it. Neither should do it, but politicians are somewhat shorter lived. > Not getting caught in such narratives is ... difficult. Posing a narrative isn't necessarily negative, as long as it is plausible and supported by evidence. For example, you could read a very good argument for Europe being wrong to go to war with Nazi Germany and have very good arguments being made based on proper evidence. You don't have to agree with it, just respect a difference of opinion. The paper the article addresses does not fall into this category.
- thecrab 3y ago
  https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/remember-the-11-million-why-an-inflated-victims-tally-irks-holocaust-historians/ https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/remember-the-11-mi... > Yehuda Bauer, an Israeli Holocaust scholar who chairs the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance, said he warned his friend Wiesenthal, who died in 2005, about spreading the false notion that the Holocaust claimed 11 million victims — 6 million Jews and 5 million non-Jews. > “I said to him, ‘Simon, you are telling a lie,’” Bauer recalled in a Jan. 31 interview. “He said, ‘Sometimes you need to do that to get the results for things you think are essential.’”
nemo44x 3y ago
> To get grants in academia now (particularly in some spaces), you have to justify how it will have some form of social justice impact. Correct. You need to show that your grant can “change the world” which is just another way of saying “create power”. And for whom? Who does this “research” or “studies” or “the science” (which isn’t actually science) give a claim to knowledge and thus power? Follow the money as the journalists say. So whatever you want to study has to generate power for someone. If your findings don’t show evidence of something that doesn’t then you’ll just stop receiving money and the ability to work. So of course academics have responded this way because it’s the incentive. It’s why everything is a “crisis”, etc.
onetimeusename 3y ago
There are other examples of this genre of history. Here is a debunking from the claim that Vikings were Muslim because something resembling the word "Allah" in Sufic was found on a Viking textile. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/allah-viking-burial-fabrics-false-kufic-inscription-clothes-name-woven-myth-islam-uppsala-sweden-funeral-customs-a8003881.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/allah-viking... There are more claims in this genre if you look for them: Hidden Figures, White House built by slaves, 1619 Project. There is probably more and there should be a compendium of false history. The common theme is that Europeans are evil and lack ability but their relative success is explained by theft and oppression from non-white people.

by bArray 3y ago

throwaway2037 3y ago

They are leaving academia and receiving a minimum of double salary in the private sector. Historians? If so, can you name a few example? I find this hard to believe.

rightbyte 3y ago
Good academics don't need to work in their field. Just any generic clerk position will do.
zztop44 3y ago
I have a friend who was a historian and now works as a data analyst for a SEO agency and makes more than double their previous salary. They had no particular expertise in SEO or data beyond being able to use Excel and being able to think and write clearly.
bArray 3y ago
> Historians? If so, can you name a few example? I find this hard to believe. I was speaking more generally about academics who are under pressure from the current political bias. As other comments have mentioned though, the critical thinking required for good historian work is also quite broadly applicable elsewhere.
WeylandYutani 3y ago
In America I can believe it. The US government doesn't fund cultural institutions very much. It's all left to private institutions (who frequently have political and ideological agendas).
- telotortium 3y ago
  Nah, both public and private universities in the US are pushing this political and ideological agenda. I'm not aware of any systematic pay difference for academics in public vs private universities - for example, Stanford (private) pays similarly to Berkeley (public), and they have similar politics. Both pay much less than private sector for anyone who can get an academic job at one of those institutions. Your comment is a little more applicable to museums and the arts, but the US government funds all universities, both public and private, pretty lavishly. Unfortunately the university administrators have a habit of accruing much of that funding to themselves and leaving the academics relatively little.

stareatgoats 3y ago

I don't think she set out to deceive, and your stated reasons for thinking so don't pan out. I believe the author of the article is right: historians have to be conscious of their narrative or the narrative will write the history. That's not being deceptive in the normal sense of the word, it's catering to a perceived true narrative, and unconsciously suppressing anything that might undermine it. Politicians do it all the time, but historians in particular should not do it. They still do: in this case painting a skewed picture of the ingenious slave, in other cases they might paint a picture of the glorious supremacy of the western civilization. Not getting caught in such narratives is ... difficult.

bArray 3y ago
> I don't think she set out to deceive, and your stated reasons for thinking so don't pan out. I believe at this moment in time she is well aware of the claims against her paper. She has not released a rebuttal to the claims, likely because she doesn't have one (otherwise she would have used stronger evidence in her paper). Every day that goes by, she leaves the paper un-adapted and un-retracted, meaning that she knowingly propagates this false narrative. It is likely she has zero intention of retracting her paper unless the journal forces her. > Politicians do it all the time, but historians in particular should not do it. Neither should do it, but politicians are somewhat shorter lived. > Not getting caught in such narratives is ... difficult. Posing a narrative isn't necessarily negative, as long as it is plausible and supported by evidence. For example, you could read a very good argument for Europe being wrong to go to war with Nazi Germany and have very good arguments being made based on proper evidence. You don't have to agree with it, just respect a difference of opinion. The paper the article addresses does not fall into this category.
thecrab 3y ago
https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/remember-the-11-million-why-an-inflated-victims-tally-irks-holocaust-historians/ https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/remember-the-11-mi... > Yehuda Bauer, an Israeli Holocaust scholar who chairs the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance, said he warned his friend Wiesenthal, who died in 2005, about spreading the false notion that the Holocaust claimed 11 million victims — 6 million Jews and 5 million non-Jews. > “I said to him, ‘Simon, you are telling a lie,’” Bauer recalled in a Jan. 31 interview. “He said, ‘Sometimes you need to do that to get the results for things you think are essential.’”

nemo44x 3y ago

> To get grants in academia now (particularly in some spaces), you have to justify how it will have some form of social justice impact. Correct. You need to show that your grant can “change the world” which is just another way of saying “create power”. And for whom? Who does this “research” or “studies” or “the science” (which isn’t actually science) give a claim to knowledge and thus power? Follow the money as the journalists say. So whatever you want to study has to generate power for someone. If your findings don’t show evidence of something that doesn’t then you’ll just stop receiving money and the ability to work. So of course academics have responded this way because it’s the incentive. It’s why everything is a “crisis”, etc.

onetimeusename 3y ago

There are other examples of this genre of history. Here is a debunking from the claim that Vikings were Muslim because something resembling the word "Allah" in Sufic was found on a Viking textile. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/allah-viking-burial-fabrics-false-kufic-inscription-clothes-name-woven-myth-islam-uppsala-sweden-funeral-customs-a8003881.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/allah-viking... There are more claims in this genre if you look for them: Hidden Figures, White House built by slaves, 1619 Project. There is probably more and there should be a compendium of false history. The common theme is that Europeans are evil and lack ability but their relative success is explained by theft and oppression from non-white people.