4 ms·

> I had no idea that Roma and Romany were not the same thing ... They aren't? Would you mind saying more about what this?

skissane 3y ago
There are several different groups which speak the Romani language(s). As the Romani spread throughout Europe, they began to diverge into different groups, with separate identities, dialects, traditions, etc. These groups have various names, including Rom, Sinti, Kale, Vlax, among others. The term Rom/Roma is ambiguous, because some authors use it to refer to the Romani-speaking groups collectively, others use the term to refer to particular subgroup(s) known by that name, as opposed to other subgroups such as the Sinti. So the above commenter had learned the “synonym for Romani collectively” definition, but is now exposed to the “specific Romani subgroup” definition, and is being introduced to that by people who view the first definition as incorrect. (I’m not much of a linguistic prescriptivist, so not sure if I agree it is “incorrect” per se, but certainly if one dislikes unintended controversy it is better avoided.)
input_sh 3y ago
The easiest way to understand where the difference comes from is that they didn't all travel to Europe in one big wave, it was in multiple waves hundreds of years apart, and they settled into and were influenced by very different European cultures (as well as cultures they passed through on their way to Europe). We tend to lump them all together into the term Romani, but there's cultural distinctions within, different dialects, etc. Probably the biggest split is a so-called North-South divide, with Romani people you'll find in the wider Balkan area being fairly distinct from those in the west-ish Europe, which themselves are distinct (but slighly less distinct) than those you'll find in the north-east-ish Europe (Belarus, Baltic states, Russia), with many smaller groups scattered across. They're pretty much all billingual and very used to borrowing words from the local languages, so it'd be rather difficult for two Romani people from opposite sides of Europe to understand each other. And we're trying to discuss them in English, which requires another translation on top of the Romani → local European language translation, which tends to get quite complicated rather quickly.

skissane 3y ago

There are several different groups which speak the Romani language(s). As the Romani spread throughout Europe, they began to diverge into different groups, with separate identities, dialects, traditions, etc. These groups have various names, including Rom, Sinti, Kale, Vlax, among others. The term Rom/Roma is ambiguous, because some authors use it to refer to the Romani-speaking groups collectively, others use the term to refer to particular subgroup(s) known by that name, as opposed to other subgroups such as the Sinti. So the above commenter had learned the “synonym for Romani collectively” definition, but is now exposed to the “specific Romani subgroup” definition, and is being introduced to that by people who view the first definition as incorrect. (I’m not much of a linguistic prescriptivist, so not sure if I agree it is “incorrect” per se, but certainly if one dislikes unintended controversy it is better avoided.)

input_sh 3y ago

The easiest way to understand where the difference comes from is that they didn't all travel to Europe in one big wave, it was in multiple waves hundreds of years apart, and they settled into and were influenced by very different European cultures (as well as cultures they passed through on their way to Europe). We tend to lump them all together into the term Romani, but there's cultural distinctions within, different dialects, etc. Probably the biggest split is a so-called North-South divide, with Romani people you'll find in the wider Balkan area being fairly distinct from those in the west-ish Europe, which themselves are distinct (but slighly less distinct) than those you'll find in the north-east-ish Europe (Belarus, Baltic states, Russia), with many smaller groups scattered across. They're pretty much all billingual and very used to borrowing words from the local languages, so it'd be rather difficult for two Romani people from opposite sides of Europe to understand each other. And we're trying to discuss them in English, which requires another translation on top of the Romani → local European language translation, which tends to get quite complicated rather quickly.