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“Says responsible developers”. That’s called rationalizing friend. This conversation can go nowhere because you believe you’re right and others are wrong. You

by rcme 3y ago

“Says responsible developers”. That’s called rationalizing friend. This conversation can go nowhere because you believe you’re right and others are wrong. You really should accept that you have a specific preference and other people have other preferences. It’s not a question of right or wrong.

zlg_codes 3y ago
I disagree, I consider it a matter of ethics when I'm deciding whether or not to add telemetry to a piece of software. Passing it off as a preference is equating them, when the software with telemetry is less trustworthy and has a broader attack surface due to network connectivity. Maybe doing all that is worth treating your users like a science project, but it's not just a preference to me. There is too much behind-the-scenes telemetry, analytics, and other intel-gathering happening on websites and in software. The gains are held solely by developers who either cannot figure out how to build their software, or whose management is so incompetent that there's no real connection to the users of the software, so making meaningful and helpful change to the software is less accessible. I strongly hold that the practice creates less durable software that also primes a user to expect their software to study their behavior and change accordingly. That is supremely creepy, and users deserve better treatment than that. It's our job as developers to respect the resources our software is using on the user's machine, and for them to be 100% informed of anything they may be sharing over the wire. Maybe that viewpoint isn't in line with VC-backed startups or enterprise, but I also don't expect them to act ethically wrt software, either... Analytics and telemetry created the data brokerage industry. Programmers are responsible for allowing that behemoth to invade and shape lives.

by rcme 3y ago

zlg_codes 3y ago

I disagree, I consider it a matter of ethics when I'm deciding whether or not to add telemetry to a piece of software. Passing it off as a preference is equating them, when the software with telemetry is less trustworthy and has a broader attack surface due to network connectivity. Maybe doing all that is worth treating your users like a science project, but it's not just a preference to me. There is too much behind-the-scenes telemetry, analytics, and other intel-gathering happening on websites and in software. The gains are held solely by developers who either cannot figure out how to build their software, or whose management is so incompetent that there's no real connection to the users of the software, so making meaningful and helpful change to the software is less accessible. I strongly hold that the practice creates less durable software that also primes a user to expect their software to study their behavior and change accordingly. That is supremely creepy, and users deserve better treatment than that. It's our job as developers to respect the resources our software is using on the user's machine, and for them to be 100% informed of anything they may be sharing over the wire. Maybe that viewpoint isn't in line with VC-backed startups or enterprise, but I also don't expect them to act ethically wrt software, either... Analytics and telemetry created the data brokerage industry. Programmers are responsible for allowing that behemoth to invade and shape lives.