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I live in Singapore and haven't found this at all. My only real complaints are (a) it's hot, and (b) it's a small, dense, urban environment with too many cars,

I live in Singapore and haven't found this at all. My only real complaints are (a) it's hot, and (b) it's a small, dense, urban environment with too many cars, it often feels quite suffocating. There is a third issue (freedom-of-speech), but I figure as a foreigner it's not my place to complain about that.

JimDabell 3y ago
Same. When I hear things like that I don’t see how it relates to Singapore at all. Maybe if you’re a tourist here for a few days and never leave the city centre, or if you’ve never visited and just read that Disneyland article that is mentioned every time Singapore comes up on Hacker News. I spent yesterday wandering around nature, saw a giant atlas moth, some snakes, and some crocodiles. The very opposite of “existentially-horrifying”.
Grimburger 3y ago
> too many cars Compared to where? Singapore is probably the best example of ubiquitous public transport on earth. Owning a car in SG is more a flaunt than sensible decision from a financial or health point of view. > There is a third issue (freedom-of-speech) As an ang moh can relate but what exactly is stifling you from speaking your mind? Here we are talking about it. The young are rising up in the country and it's great to see, there's been windbacks on laws against gays along with other pretty stark sentiment changes in the population, there's a real fear in the ruling party about being the first to lose government and they are quick to bend to the whims of the populace. The main outlet for an everyday person is online and here we are. No one is stopping you, no one is certainly stopping r/singaporeraw > small, dense, urban environment Borneo, one of the most biologically diverse places on Earth is an hour away on a plane. There's untamed jungle trails an hour across the border if you care to walk them. > it's hot For the first few months, then you adapt.
- noobermin 3y ago
  Singapore has a very high level of space devoted to car infrastructure. It has little infrastructure for cyclists, despite cycling being a large part of it's history and a common use of transport for many today, so pedestrians are forced to fight for space with cyclists on the tiny drain cover sidewalks that do exist. In SG, by law you have to yield to cars everywhere, some have internalised this so much they yield even in zebra crossings that by law motorists have to yield to pedestrians. Walking in sg is a chore, given you have to yield at every informal crossing (termed "unmarked crosswalk" in US parlance). This is even more mafan on bicycle because you have to stop and stand. All of this for a city where only 11% of people own a car, mostly people who are wealthy enough to afford COE, meaning they can fork over 100K+ sgd every ten years just to drive, or have company car (rich ang mo), it's a great example of the class stratification that exists but has been systematically squeezed out of the consciousness and discussion or has been substituted by racial or anti-foreigner sentiments. The public transit saves the city and the fact walkways do exist everywhere is great and a lot better than for example the US (hard to do worse than the worst), but it is seriously car centric of a city.
  - Grimburger 3y ago
    > it has little infrastructure for cyclists Singapore has over 500km of cycle ways: https://www.lta.gov.sg/content/ltagov/en/getting_around/active_mobility/walking_cycling_infrastructure/cycling.html https://www.lta.gov.sg/content/ltagov/en/getting_around/acti... What are you comparing it to when you say "little infrastructure for cyclists"? You need to be very clear about who is the competition here worldwide because they are aiming for 1300km of cycleways by 2030 and this is a tiny city state 50km wide.
    - delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
      > You need to be very clear about who is the competition here worldwide Since Singapore likes to set extremely high standards for itself, its competition is places like Amsterdam, Copenhagen, Cambridge, etc. Admittedly the parent commenter mentioned 'infrastructure', which Singapore has a bit of, but there's more to cycling than just pathways laid across the ground and painted with bicycle motifs. For Singapore to be truly a 'good place for cycling', it's got to have the right mindset for cycling. This means giving less priority to motor vehicles. Singapore ought to narrow its roads. There are too many non-highway stroads, and there is no reason for a semi-residential road to be 3+ lanes wide in each direction—look at any number of the Avenues in Toa Payoh, Ang Mo Kio, Bishan, Serangoon, Queenstown, Bukit Batok, Bedok, etc etc. Cars can easily reach 70+ km/h on these roads, which also makes it very unsafe for cyclists and pedestrians. The extra space from getting rid of these lanes could instead be used for much wider footpaths and grade-separated cycle lanes. Pedestrianise the city centre and residential cores. This is related to the point above, but some roads (e.g. in the CBD) could be completely blocked from vehicle access altogether. Consider using trams in the CBD instead of buses and trains. Improve bike-parking infrastructure. There are a handful of bike-parking spaces around MRT stations, but very few in other common areas like parks, HDB void decks, hawker centres, etc. Again, refer to the cities above for examples of how dense bike parking could possibly be. Bring back park-and-rides. Singapore used to have them, but ditched them in favour of directly linking the heartlands into the city, which have made MRTs packed. Incentivise bicycle ownerships: vouchers for bike shops, cycle-buying schemes, and of course, a bicycle licensing scheme similar to e-scooters and e-bikes (and cars). There's a lot more, but these are the lowest hanging fruits.

JimDabell 3y ago

Same. When I hear things like that I don’t see how it relates to Singapore at all. Maybe if you’re a tourist here for a few days and never leave the city centre, or if you’ve never visited and just read that Disneyland article that is mentioned every time Singapore comes up on Hacker News. I spent yesterday wandering around nature, saw a giant atlas moth, some snakes, and some crocodiles. The very opposite of “existentially-horrifying”.

Grimburger 3y ago

> too many cars Compared to where? Singapore is probably the best example of ubiquitous public transport on earth. Owning a car in SG is more a flaunt than sensible decision from a financial or health point of view. > There is a third issue (freedom-of-speech) As an ang moh can relate but what exactly is stifling you from speaking your mind? Here we are talking about it. The young are rising up in the country and it's great to see, there's been windbacks on laws against gays along with other pretty stark sentiment changes in the population, there's a real fear in the ruling party about being the first to lose government and they are quick to bend to the whims of the populace. The main outlet for an everyday person is online and here we are. No one is stopping you, no one is certainly stopping r/singaporeraw > small, dense, urban environment Borneo, one of the most biologically diverse places on Earth is an hour away on a plane. There's untamed jungle trails an hour across the border if you care to walk them. > it's hot For the first few months, then you adapt.

noobermin 3y ago
Singapore has a very high level of space devoted to car infrastructure. It has little infrastructure for cyclists, despite cycling being a large part of it's history and a common use of transport for many today, so pedestrians are forced to fight for space with cyclists on the tiny drain cover sidewalks that do exist. In SG, by law you have to yield to cars everywhere, some have internalised this so much they yield even in zebra crossings that by law motorists have to yield to pedestrians. Walking in sg is a chore, given you have to yield at every informal crossing (termed "unmarked crosswalk" in US parlance). This is even more mafan on bicycle because you have to stop and stand. All of this for a city where only 11% of people own a car, mostly people who are wealthy enough to afford COE, meaning they can fork over 100K+ sgd every ten years just to drive, or have company car (rich ang mo), it's a great example of the class stratification that exists but has been systematically squeezed out of the consciousness and discussion or has been substituted by racial or anti-foreigner sentiments. The public transit saves the city and the fact walkways do exist everywhere is great and a lot better than for example the US (hard to do worse than the worst), but it is seriously car centric of a city.
- Grimburger 3y ago
  > it has little infrastructure for cyclists Singapore has over 500km of cycle ways: https://www.lta.gov.sg/content/ltagov/en/getting_around/active_mobility/walking_cycling_infrastructure/cycling.html https://www.lta.gov.sg/content/ltagov/en/getting_around/acti... What are you comparing it to when you say "little infrastructure for cyclists"? You need to be very clear about who is the competition here worldwide because they are aiming for 1300km of cycleways by 2030 and this is a tiny city state 50km wide.
  - delta_p_delta_x 3y ago
    > You need to be very clear about who is the competition here worldwide Since Singapore likes to set extremely high standards for itself, its competition is places like Amsterdam, Copenhagen, Cambridge, etc. Admittedly the parent commenter mentioned 'infrastructure', which Singapore has a bit of, but there's more to cycling than just pathways laid across the ground and painted with bicycle motifs. For Singapore to be truly a 'good place for cycling', it's got to have the right mindset for cycling. This means giving less priority to motor vehicles. Singapore ought to narrow its roads. There are too many non-highway stroads, and there is no reason for a semi-residential road to be 3+ lanes wide in each direction—look at any number of the Avenues in Toa Payoh, Ang Mo Kio, Bishan, Serangoon, Queenstown, Bukit Batok, Bedok, etc etc. Cars can easily reach 70+ km/h on these roads, which also makes it very unsafe for cyclists and pedestrians. The extra space from getting rid of these lanes could instead be used for much wider footpaths and grade-separated cycle lanes. Pedestrianise the city centre and residential cores. This is related to the point above, but some roads (e.g. in the CBD) could be completely blocked from vehicle access altogether. Consider using trams in the CBD instead of buses and trains. Improve bike-parking infrastructure. There are a handful of bike-parking spaces around MRT stations, but very few in other common areas like parks, HDB void decks, hawker centres, etc. Again, refer to the cities above for examples of how dense bike parking could possibly be. Bring back park-and-rides. Singapore used to have them, but ditched them in favour of directly linking the heartlands into the city, which have made MRTs packed. Incentivise bicycle ownerships: vouchers for bike shops, cycle-buying schemes, and of course, a bicycle licensing scheme similar to e-scooters and e-bikes (and cars). There's a lot more, but these are the lowest hanging fruits.