4 ms·

You’re not alone. If you want a movie with actual complexity, watch Primer. Oh, you’ll probably think you get it the first time through, because the writing is

You’re not alone. If you want a movie with actual complexity, watch Primer. Oh, you’ll probably think you get it the first time through, because the writing is great. Then you’ll rewatch it a couple times and see just how much you missed, because the writing is brilliant.

deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
Cushman 15y ago
> Then you’ll rewatch it a couple times and see just how much you missed, because the writing is brilliant. ...and the audio is pretty inconsistent :P But seriously, seconded. One of my absolute favorite films of all time, and made on a budget in the thousands. Completely stunning.
- evincarofautumn 15y ago
  I would go so far as to say it’s my favourite film bar none, and I don’t say such a thing lightly. It has its flaws, but it speaks to me. What’s more stunning still is that most of the $7,000 budget was film stock. Because it was filmed. On film. Ain’t nothing like the 16mm look, truly.
  - maaku 15y ago
    > What’s more stunning still is that most of the $7,000 budget was film stock. Because it was filmed. On film. Ain’t nothing like the 16mm look, truly. And what's even more stunning is that most of it was done in one take because, well, they only had $7,000 to budget on film stock.
    - trafficlight 15y ago
      Shane Caruth also starred in the movie, wrote it, directed it, edited, and wrote the soundtrack all on his own dime. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primer_(film) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primer_(film)
irishcoffee 15y ago
Thanks much, I'll check it out. I'm a huge sucker for movies like that.
sp332 15y ago
Completely relevant https://xkcd.com/657/ https://xkcd.com/657/ Edit: This is completely on-topic, why the downvotes? Edit2: originally said "obligatory" but maybe that's too meme-ish for HN.
- Cushman 15y ago
  Didn't downvote you, but generally speaking people on HN prefer comments which are insightful and implicitly constructive, and not well-known links reposted out of some weird sense of non-existent internet obligation.
- throwaway1972 15y ago
  Maybe you should have linked to an actually useful attempt at breaking down the very complex timeline of primer: http://www.screened.com/primer/16-61068/all-images/132-637554/primer_timeline/131-248887/ http://www.screened.com/primer/16-61068/all-images/132-63755...
rthomas6 15y ago
I sort of disagree. I've seen Primer several times, and am a fan of the movie, but I get the feeling that the writers purposefully made the movie confusing just for the sake of being confusing. The complexity doesn't seem to arise organically out of the plotline. A lot of the confusion is generated out of not hearing the one time in the movie someone explained something, or from the movie not explaining something that is easily explainable. It's almost as if the writers could have made the plotline easier to follow while keeping the plot the same, but at times purposefully chose to obfuscate it solely for the purpose of making a "complex" movie.
- evincarofautumn 15y ago
  That is a good point. One of the things I loved, though, is that the characters don’t bother to mention things they already know, or explain things they already understand. They say real things like “um” and “y’know” and “could you hand me the…no, the other—yeah, thanks”. This is undoubtedly a major source of confusion, but it serves less to increase complexity than to convey a sense of the characters’ relationship. The plot could absolutely have been told simplier without changing it, but the feel would have been very different. I know the movie isn’t perfect, but I like it for what it is.
  - nooneelse 15y ago
    I too very much like the dialogue in Primer for that 'eavesdropping on people who know each other well' feeling it has.
pi3832 15y ago
They're not up to Primer's level of complexity, but for bending your brain a little, try: eXistenZ (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120907/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120907/) Naked Lunch (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102511/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102511/) (And other David Cronenberg movies. While I'm at it, although it's completely linear, I'm going to plug: "Crash" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115964/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115964/).) Jacob's Ladder (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099871/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099871/) is almost a great brain-bending movie, but for some damn reason at the very end there's a, "Let's explain what really happened!" scene. F'idiots. (I recommend stopping the movie when you get to the scene where the Jacob and his son (played by Macaulay Culkin) dreamily walk up a back-lit stairway together. Let the movie percolate in your brain for a while. Then, start the movie up again and see how they ruined it.)
- kstenerud 15y ago
  All great movies. Some others (with varying degrees of sophistication): The 13th Floor (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0139809/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0139809/) A Scanner Darkly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/) Brazil (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088846/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088846/) Time Bandits (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081633/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081633/) Dark City (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118929/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118929/) - A little disappointing at the end though =/
  - evincarofautumn 15y ago
    I really enjoyed Dark City. The directors cut is best, though, because it doesn’t give away the twist at the beginning like the theatrical cut did.
  - psykotic 15y ago
    > A Scanner Darkly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/) It's worth watching for many reasons, but it'd be worth watching for this scene alone: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2HP25bKztE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2HP25bKztE
jpeterson 15y ago
Congratulations, you're smart. Do you want a cookie?
swah 15y ago
I watched only once, will rewatch now!

deleted 15y ago

[deleted]

Cushman 15y ago

> Then you’ll rewatch it a couple times and see just how much you missed, because the writing is brilliant. ...and the audio is pretty inconsistent :P But seriously, seconded. One of my absolute favorite films of all time, and made on a budget in the thousands. Completely stunning.

evincarofautumn 15y ago
I would go so far as to say it’s my favourite film bar none, and I don’t say such a thing lightly. It has its flaws, but it speaks to me. What’s more stunning still is that most of the $7,000 budget was film stock. Because it was filmed. On film. Ain’t nothing like the 16mm look, truly.
- maaku 15y ago
  > What’s more stunning still is that most of the $7,000 budget was film stock. Because it was filmed. On film. Ain’t nothing like the 16mm look, truly. And what's even more stunning is that most of it was done in one take because, well, they only had $7,000 to budget on film stock.
  - trafficlight 15y ago
    Shane Caruth also starred in the movie, wrote it, directed it, edited, and wrote the soundtrack all on his own dime. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primer_(film) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primer_(film)

irishcoffee 15y ago

Thanks much, I'll check it out. I'm a huge sucker for movies like that.

sp332 15y ago

Completely relevant https://xkcd.com/657/ https://xkcd.com/657/ Edit: This is completely on-topic, why the downvotes? Edit2: originally said "obligatory" but maybe that's too meme-ish for HN.

Cushman 15y ago
Didn't downvote you, but generally speaking people on HN prefer comments which are insightful and implicitly constructive, and not well-known links reposted out of some weird sense of non-existent internet obligation.
throwaway1972 15y ago
Maybe you should have linked to an actually useful attempt at breaking down the very complex timeline of primer: http://www.screened.com/primer/16-61068/all-images/132-637554/primer_timeline/131-248887/ http://www.screened.com/primer/16-61068/all-images/132-63755...

rthomas6 15y ago

I sort of disagree. I've seen Primer several times, and am a fan of the movie, but I get the feeling that the writers purposefully made the movie confusing just for the sake of being confusing. The complexity doesn't seem to arise organically out of the plotline. A lot of the confusion is generated out of not hearing the one time in the movie someone explained something, or from the movie not explaining something that is easily explainable. It's almost as if the writers could have made the plotline easier to follow while keeping the plot the same, but at times purposefully chose to obfuscate it solely for the purpose of making a "complex" movie.

evincarofautumn 15y ago
That is a good point. One of the things I loved, though, is that the characters don’t bother to mention things they already know, or explain things they already understand. They say real things like “um” and “y’know” and “could you hand me the…no, the other—yeah, thanks”. This is undoubtedly a major source of confusion, but it serves less to increase complexity than to convey a sense of the characters’ relationship. The plot could absolutely have been told simplier without changing it, but the feel would have been very different. I know the movie isn’t perfect, but I like it for what it is.
- nooneelse 15y ago
  I too very much like the dialogue in Primer for that 'eavesdropping on people who know each other well' feeling it has.

pi3832 15y ago

They're not up to Primer's level of complexity, but for bending your brain a little, try: eXistenZ (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120907/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120907/) Naked Lunch (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102511/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102511/) (And other David Cronenberg movies. While I'm at it, although it's completely linear, I'm going to plug: "Crash" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115964/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0115964/).) Jacob's Ladder (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099871/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099871/) is almost a great brain-bending movie, but for some damn reason at the very end there's a, "Let's explain what really happened!" scene. F'idiots. (I recommend stopping the movie when you get to the scene where the Jacob and his son (played by Macaulay Culkin) dreamily walk up a back-lit stairway together. Let the movie percolate in your brain for a while. Then, start the movie up again and see how they ruined it.)

kstenerud 15y ago
All great movies. Some others (with varying degrees of sophistication): The 13th Floor (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0139809/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0139809/) A Scanner Darkly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/) Brazil (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088846/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088846/) Time Bandits (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081633/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081633/) Dark City (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118929/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118929/) - A little disappointing at the end though =/
- evincarofautumn 15y ago
  I really enjoyed Dark City. The directors cut is best, though, because it doesn’t give away the twist at the beginning like the theatrical cut did.
- psykotic 15y ago
  > A Scanner Darkly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/ http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405296/) It's worth watching for many reasons, but it'd be worth watching for this scene alone: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2HP25bKztE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2HP25bKztE

jpeterson 15y ago

Congratulations, you're smart. Do you want a cookie?

swah 15y ago

I watched only once, will rewatch now!