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Actually that's the funny part, this "joke" was in no way belittling women, it's idolizing them. It was made at the expense of the stereotypical male geek to wh

Actually that's the funny part, this "joke" was in no way belittling women, it's idolizing them. It was made at the expense of the stereotypical male geek to whom women are otherwise inaccessible. Somehow it was appropriated as being about the female attendees.

knowtheory 15y ago
Having/Wanting someone to serve you is not "idolizing". And as said elsewhere, just because you say shitty things about everyone doesn't mean that it's okay to say shitty things.
- thoradam 15y ago
  > Having/Wanting someone to serve you is not "idolizing". Is that the point of contention, that people feel that serving someone is demeaning? > And as said elsewhere, just because you say shitty things about everyone doesn't mean that it's okay to say shitty things. So you agree that the comment wasn't slighting women? Or are you just generally offended by all the possible interpretations?
Gayle 15y ago
Yes... it's idolizing women... as sexual objects offered as a perk to male coders so that they can serve the men. As a female coder, I'd rather not be offered as a perk to male coders. So, yeah, this is belittling.
- thoradam 15y ago
  It wasn't directed at the female attendees at all. Here's how it was meant: "Hey lonely geeks: you will have the chance to meet women there because our catering staff is female." Did you interpret it as though they were planning to force the female attendees to serve the male attendees beer?
- deleted 15y ago
  [deleted]
  - DanBC 15y ago
    No. You are wrong. The original flyer was clearly offering a perk of women delivering beer. The perk is first named "Women:" and then described "Need another beer? Let one of our friendly (female) staff get that for you." That first word "women:" is not aimed at a female audience. It's aimed at a male audience. It's clumsily using stereotypes of programmers as mostly single males. That's pretty offensive in itself.
    - WayneDB 15y ago
      Thank you. I had trouble finding the original advert and I thought that sentence was the entire ad. When I finally found it, I came back and deleted my posts. Sorry about that.
- WayneDB 15y ago
  You weren't being offered as a perk to male coders though. Other women were not even "being offered". Saying that women will be serving beer has nothing to do with the act of sex. If you think so, then you're reading way too far into it.
  - DanBC 15y ago
    Can you honestly not see how telling a bunch of men that they will be served by friendly female staff is appealing to sexual desire? I'm not sure why you say that other women were not being offered. Here's the item in the list of perks. "Women: Need another beer? Let one of our friendly (female) staff get that for you.""
    - WayneDB 15y ago
      The women themselves were not being offered. Serving of beer by women was being offered. The chance to meet a woman was being offered. Nobody was offering sex with a woman or any kind of woman sex slave. If I advertise a mixer where men and women can meet each other, does anyone have a problem with that? I don't think so. Should we all get mad at Hooters or Chipendales next? (EDIT: Seriously, do you really think that men should be offended that Chipendales exists? Why?)
    - WayneDB 15y ago
      Also, I'd like to know... what's wrong with appealing to sexual desire? The women were not being offered as chattel. There's nothing wrong with sex. You really have to work to be offended by this one. Well, maybe you don't, but it certainly defies logic unless you read into it, which you are most certainly doing because the words themselves don't really back you up.
    - WayneDB 15y ago
      Sorry for replying three times but after talking about it with my wife for a couple of hours, we both agree...this is an absolute over-reaction and a projection of women's general frustration onto a non-issue. It would be like men getting angry that there are entire trade shows that exclude men, such as this one - http://peters.patch.com/articles/annual-fashion-show-benefits-women-and-children-in-need http://peters.patch.com/articles/annual-fashion-show-benefit...

knowtheory 15y ago

Having/Wanting someone to serve you is not "idolizing". And as said elsewhere, just because you say shitty things about everyone doesn't mean that it's okay to say shitty things.

thoradam 15y ago
> Having/Wanting someone to serve you is not "idolizing". Is that the point of contention, that people feel that serving someone is demeaning? > And as said elsewhere, just because you say shitty things about everyone doesn't mean that it's okay to say shitty things. So you agree that the comment wasn't slighting women? Or are you just generally offended by all the possible interpretations?

Gayle 15y ago

Yes... it's idolizing women... as sexual objects offered as a perk to male coders so that they can serve the men. As a female coder, I'd rather not be offered as a perk to male coders. So, yeah, this is belittling.

thoradam 15y ago
It wasn't directed at the female attendees at all. Here's how it was meant: "Hey lonely geeks: you will have the chance to meet women there because our catering staff is female." Did you interpret it as though they were planning to force the female attendees to serve the male attendees beer?
deleted 15y ago
[deleted]
- DanBC 15y ago
  No. You are wrong. The original flyer was clearly offering a perk of women delivering beer. The perk is first named "Women:" and then described "Need another beer? Let one of our friendly (female) staff get that for you." That first word "women:" is not aimed at a female audience. It's aimed at a male audience. It's clumsily using stereotypes of programmers as mostly single males. That's pretty offensive in itself.
  - WayneDB 15y ago
    Thank you. I had trouble finding the original advert and I thought that sentence was the entire ad. When I finally found it, I came back and deleted my posts. Sorry about that.
WayneDB 15y ago
You weren't being offered as a perk to male coders though. Other women were not even "being offered". Saying that women will be serving beer has nothing to do with the act of sex. If you think so, then you're reading way too far into it.
- DanBC 15y ago
  Can you honestly not see how telling a bunch of men that they will be served by friendly female staff is appealing to sexual desire? I'm not sure why you say that other women were not being offered. Here's the item in the list of perks. "Women: Need another beer? Let one of our friendly (female) staff get that for you.""
  - WayneDB 15y ago
    The women themselves were not being offered. Serving of beer by women was being offered. The chance to meet a woman was being offered. Nobody was offering sex with a woman or any kind of woman sex slave. If I advertise a mixer where men and women can meet each other, does anyone have a problem with that? I don't think so. Should we all get mad at Hooters or Chipendales next? (EDIT: Seriously, do you really think that men should be offended that Chipendales exists? Why?)
  - WayneDB 15y ago
    Also, I'd like to know... what's wrong with appealing to sexual desire? The women were not being offered as chattel. There's nothing wrong with sex. You really have to work to be offended by this one. Well, maybe you don't, but it certainly defies logic unless you read into it, which you are most certainly doing because the words themselves don't really back you up.
  - WayneDB 15y ago
    Sorry for replying three times but after talking about it with my wife for a couple of hours, we both agree...this is an absolute over-reaction and a projection of women's general frustration onto a non-issue. It would be like men getting angry that there are entire trade shows that exclude men, such as this one - http://peters.patch.com/articles/annual-fashion-show-benefits-women-and-children-in-need http://peters.patch.com/articles/annual-fashion-show-benefit...