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> “My grandmother was extremely proud that her father had a very low number” In Finland, a local operator built the world’s first commercial GSM network back i

by pavlov 3y ago

> “My grandmother was extremely proud that her father had a very low number” In Finland, a local operator built the world’s first commercial GSM network back in 1991. They initially sold four-digit phone numbers as a perk. (Combined with the country code and the operator code, the numbers today look like this: +358 50 1234) Those short numbers are still being resold by their owners. I’ve heard some of them go for tens of thousands of euros. The psychology of valuable numbers is pretty interesting. NFTs are basically that. You don’t even own the JPEG, you just own a number in a database that indicates that image. And if your ugly ape picture number is 24 and some poor sap has ugly ape picture number 1581, surely that makes you richer and more envied.

bambax 3y ago
We're not immune to this. Internet points or "karma" on this very website work the same way.
- pavlov 3y ago
  Absolutely. But the coveted big number, an ever-accumulating ledger balance, is a different kind of valuable number than the small number, which generally represents a distance to the origin of the number cult. Lower is better because it’s closer to the source. Elon Musk has the biggest big numbers of them all. But that doesn’t mean he could acquire every kind of valuable small number that exists. He can definitely buy a low-numbered NFT, and he can probably buy an early Picasso (though there aren’t many not in museums). But he can’t buy himself a low Erdős number for example. This is what traditionally separates the nouveaux riches from old money: the first are interested in the big numbers, the latter in the small ones. (“My great great grandfather was the second Earl of Somethingdom.”)
  - dale_glass 3y ago
    > But he can’t buy himself a low Erdős number for example. Why not? With that much money I'm sure he can spend enough to convince somebody with a low number to "collaborate" with him in some capacity. Even if it's spell checking the English text or something.
    - pavlov 3y ago
      It's true, academic institutions are quite good at selling their prestige to donors (honorary titles, etc.) So probably he could do this most easily by donating a pile of money to an institution who employs someone with a suitably low number, who then paper-collaborates with the rich donor. Nobody loses face in such a coordinated sell-out. The mathematician did it because it got the math department a $100 million grant. The rich guy is now a recognized patron of the noble science. The university administrators are pleased that they can direct their fundraising efforts elsewhere. And eventually the rich guy's son gets to use this as a talking point to highlight how he's probably inherited some of the family genius: "My father was actually quite an accomplished mathematician too" — nobody remembers or cares 30 years later how it actually went down.
      - bambax 3y ago
        > nobody remembers or cares 30 years later how it actually went down Or, nobody remembers why the number is valuable. That was the problem with my grandmother; when she told the story to us, telephone numbers had looong ceased to be significant (or indeed, hard to get) so the fact that yours was small or big didn't mean anything, and it sounded so strange to us that one would cherish it.
    - buran77 3y ago
      Musk managed to buy the low low "number" of co-founder [0] of Tesla. So in my opinion if something is arbitrary it can be bought with enough money. [0] https://www.cnet.com/culture/tesla-motors-founders-now-there-are-five/ https://www.cnet.com/culture/tesla-motors-founders-now-there...
    - CrazyStat 3y ago
      https://www.sciencenews.org/article/theorems-sale https://www.sciencenews.org/article/theorems-sale
The_Colonel 3y ago
A very similar thing happened with ICQ numbers where short (or pretty) numbers were prestigious and were sometimes sold. I think there's a difference from NFTs in the fact that ICQs and telephones were heavily used tools for communication, this is what lends these numbers the prestige. Since everybody used them to communicate with you, everyone saw that prestigious number. In comparison, NFTs aren't really attached to something of value in the same way and are not interesting/prestigious to anybody outside of people interested in those NFTs specifically.
atoav 3y ago
We had a phone number with 6 digits (without the international code in front). When my father had to enter the phone number in some hotel form when he was abroad the guy was totally convinced he must be some sort of royal, president or another kind of very important person, when in fact we are just from a very rual part of a very small nation.

by pavlov 3y ago

bambax 3y ago

We're not immune to this. Internet points or "karma" on this very website work the same way.

pavlov 3y ago
Absolutely. But the coveted big number, an ever-accumulating ledger balance, is a different kind of valuable number than the small number, which generally represents a distance to the origin of the number cult. Lower is better because it’s closer to the source. Elon Musk has the biggest big numbers of them all. But that doesn’t mean he could acquire every kind of valuable small number that exists. He can definitely buy a low-numbered NFT, and he can probably buy an early Picasso (though there aren’t many not in museums). But he can’t buy himself a low Erdős number for example. This is what traditionally separates the nouveaux riches from old money: the first are interested in the big numbers, the latter in the small ones. (“My great great grandfather was the second Earl of Somethingdom.”)
- dale_glass 3y ago
  > But he can’t buy himself a low Erdős number for example. Why not? With that much money I'm sure he can spend enough to convince somebody with a low number to "collaborate" with him in some capacity. Even if it's spell checking the English text or something.
  - pavlov 3y ago
    It's true, academic institutions are quite good at selling their prestige to donors (honorary titles, etc.) So probably he could do this most easily by donating a pile of money to an institution who employs someone with a suitably low number, who then paper-collaborates with the rich donor. Nobody loses face in such a coordinated sell-out. The mathematician did it because it got the math department a $100 million grant. The rich guy is now a recognized patron of the noble science. The university administrators are pleased that they can direct their fundraising efforts elsewhere. And eventually the rich guy's son gets to use this as a talking point to highlight how he's probably inherited some of the family genius: "My father was actually quite an accomplished mathematician too" — nobody remembers or cares 30 years later how it actually went down.
    - bambax 3y ago
      > nobody remembers or cares 30 years later how it actually went down Or, nobody remembers why the number is valuable. That was the problem with my grandmother; when she told the story to us, telephone numbers had looong ceased to be significant (or indeed, hard to get) so the fact that yours was small or big didn't mean anything, and it sounded so strange to us that one would cherish it.
  - buran77 3y ago
    Musk managed to buy the low low "number" of co-founder [0] of Tesla. So in my opinion if something is arbitrary it can be bought with enough money. [0] https://www.cnet.com/culture/tesla-motors-founders-now-there-are-five/ https://www.cnet.com/culture/tesla-motors-founders-now-there...
  - CrazyStat 3y ago
    https://www.sciencenews.org/article/theorems-sale https://www.sciencenews.org/article/theorems-sale

The_Colonel 3y ago

A very similar thing happened with ICQ numbers where short (or pretty) numbers were prestigious and were sometimes sold. I think there's a difference from NFTs in the fact that ICQs and telephones were heavily used tools for communication, this is what lends these numbers the prestige. Since everybody used them to communicate with you, everyone saw that prestigious number. In comparison, NFTs aren't really attached to something of value in the same way and are not interesting/prestigious to anybody outside of people interested in those NFTs specifically.

atoav 3y ago

We had a phone number with 6 digits (without the international code in front). When my father had to enter the phone number in some hotel form when he was abroad the guy was totally convinced he must be some sort of royal, president or another kind of very important person, when in fact we are just from a very rual part of a very small nation.