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I wonder if companies like VanMoof just had a very small window there where they were compelling. I think when the VanMoof came out it was sleek and easy to us

I wonder if companies like VanMoof just had a very small window there where they were compelling. I think when the VanMoof came out it was sleek and easy to use in a field of much more clunky eBikes. Now, if you want something that looks good on the road and is easy to operate, you have a lot of options, including ones from familiar bike manufacturers. Suddenly VanMoof no longer had such a differentiating factor compared to everyone else.

brnt 3y ago
VanMoof seemed to be a riff on Juicero: expensive custom parts specifically designed to keep you a lifelong overpaying customer.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  The overpaying started right on day #1.
- vanderZwan 3y ago
  That one video of an engineer taking a Juicero apart and just being stunned from start to finish that it's built from the most expensive, high-quality parts imaginable, making it possibly the most over-engineered piece of junk ever, is probably one of the most entertaining YT videos I've ever seen.
  - yurishimo 3y ago
    I assume you mean this one from AvE? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ
    - vanderZwan 3y ago
      Yes, thank you for looking it up! Just skimming through it makes me giggle again. The engineers must have had so much fun. And given that their client was selling fruit juice with always online DRM, they probably did the world a service by ensuring said company failed faster by causing a net loss with each unit sold
    - dewey 3y ago
      I haven't seen this before, thanks for sharing. You can almost hear how heavy some of these parts are.
jacquesm 3y ago
No, they could have succeeded if they didn't ship crappy quality. Vertical integration is doable if you deliver quality. If you don't then you will end up with more warranty work than you can handle because nobody else has access to your parts.
- nickromano 3y ago
  Yup I happily bought a Vanmoof S2 when it came out (2019) thinking it would be seamless and I could take it into the local Vanmoof shop whenever there were issues. It turned out to be a lot less reliable than I had hoped, and there were issues with the hardware AND the software. Making it super frustrating that it was all integrated. Software - If the bike wasn't used for a few weeks it would turn itself back into "shipping mode" and I would need to reset the bike with a pin. - Settings were forgotten almost every time the bike went to sleep, it would reset the sounds settings so turning it on or unlocking it would always play the cheesy sound effects no matter how many times I turned them off. - For the first year or so the app would regularly log me out. And the design of the app at the time made it look like you were chatting with a bot so it would take longer to login than needed. Thankfully they redesigned it. Hardware - The integrated back wheel lock will now only unlock if I move the bike a few inches, any additional inches and the lock re-locks itself. - The bike would randomly show an error code and drop power. Vanmoof replaced the battery and onboard computer but I have had it occasionally show error codes since and am nervous it'll turn into a brick at some point. I now also own a regular cargo bike and the difference has been night and day. It doesn't look as cool, and requires more locks to keep it all secure. But it's dumb and just works, and I can do a lot of the service myself (excluding the electronics). Removing the back wheel on the Vanmoof is super challenging and makes me nervous about getting a flat.
  - jacquesm 3y ago
    I'd never want a bike that can lock itself remotely, my big fear would be the same as what you get when you have an irresponsible and inquisitive toddler at the back of the bike: "I wonder what would happen if I locked daddy's bike while we're cruising along?" Only then without the toddler... What in particular do you service on the electronics of your cargo bike?

brnt 3y ago

VanMoof seemed to be a riff on Juicero: expensive custom parts specifically designed to keep you a lifelong overpaying customer.

jacquesm 3y ago
The overpaying started right on day #1.
vanderZwan 3y ago
That one video of an engineer taking a Juicero apart and just being stunned from start to finish that it's built from the most expensive, high-quality parts imaginable, making it possibly the most over-engineered piece of junk ever, is probably one of the most entertaining YT videos I've ever seen.
- yurishimo 3y ago
  I assume you mean this one from AvE? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Cp-BGQfpHQ
  - vanderZwan 3y ago
    Yes, thank you for looking it up! Just skimming through it makes me giggle again. The engineers must have had so much fun. And given that their client was selling fruit juice with always online DRM, they probably did the world a service by ensuring said company failed faster by causing a net loss with each unit sold
  - dewey 3y ago
    I haven't seen this before, thanks for sharing. You can almost hear how heavy some of these parts are.

jacquesm 3y ago

No, they could have succeeded if they didn't ship crappy quality. Vertical integration is doable if you deliver quality. If you don't then you will end up with more warranty work than you can handle because nobody else has access to your parts.

nickromano 3y ago
Yup I happily bought a Vanmoof S2 when it came out (2019) thinking it would be seamless and I could take it into the local Vanmoof shop whenever there were issues. It turned out to be a lot less reliable than I had hoped, and there were issues with the hardware AND the software. Making it super frustrating that it was all integrated. Software - If the bike wasn't used for a few weeks it would turn itself back into "shipping mode" and I would need to reset the bike with a pin. - Settings were forgotten almost every time the bike went to sleep, it would reset the sounds settings so turning it on or unlocking it would always play the cheesy sound effects no matter how many times I turned them off. - For the first year or so the app would regularly log me out. And the design of the app at the time made it look like you were chatting with a bot so it would take longer to login than needed. Thankfully they redesigned it. Hardware - The integrated back wheel lock will now only unlock if I move the bike a few inches, any additional inches and the lock re-locks itself. - The bike would randomly show an error code and drop power. Vanmoof replaced the battery and onboard computer but I have had it occasionally show error codes since and am nervous it'll turn into a brick at some point. I now also own a regular cargo bike and the difference has been night and day. It doesn't look as cool, and requires more locks to keep it all secure. But it's dumb and just works, and I can do a lot of the service myself (excluding the electronics). Removing the back wheel on the Vanmoof is super challenging and makes me nervous about getting a flat.
- jacquesm 3y ago
  I'd never want a bike that can lock itself remotely, my big fear would be the same as what you get when you have an irresponsible and inquisitive toddler at the back of the bike: "I wonder what would happen if I locked daddy's bike while we're cruising along?" Only then without the toddler... What in particular do you service on the electronics of your cargo bike?