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Just tell folks on the right that ai is going to take their rights, freedoms and guns and let them run with it. I am not joking, the only way to "wake" people u

Just tell folks on the right that ai is going to take their rights, freedoms and guns and let them run with it. I am not joking, the only way to "wake" people up is to leverage those that, oddly enough, have predicted many of the upcoming changes. The issues with their conspiracy theories are with the how, whom, and why. There's no cabal of folks injecting people with microcips to control them and covid wasn't it. It's just regular corporations and corrupt politicians selling them technological sweets in order to extort them for money. Easy. Let them run wild, and hopefully the left and the right find middle ground and change this trajectory.

Barrin92 3y ago
the logical endpoint of that is some crazy guy shooting up a pizza place, not civil society taking back control of technology pointed at them. Ever played the original Deus Ex? There's a reason Musk on his Bob Page arc loves to stoke conspiracy nonsense and it isn't because it produces effective, rational governance reigning powerful people in
- gumballindie 3y ago
  > the logical endpoint of that is some crazy guy shooting up a pizza place That's the likely outcome if people are lead towards that outcome and if that's the only given option. And so far the only voices that validate their concerns are those that would benefit from such outcomes. Those that want a "better world" are too busy berrating those that have genuine concerns and as a result the only people they can take refuge in are those like Musk. It's time for genuine innovation and genuine conversation without losing track of the good in both sides.
  - randysalami 3y ago
    Social platform that indexes each user based on their belief system. Create a bunch of these cells, explicit echo chambers and watch people radicalize like never before. Reddit but for fascists and only fascists; Reddit but for liberals and only liberals; Reddit for communists and only communists. Each cell acts as its own social media platform similar to how Mastodon works. The primary differences are: A. Cells are centralized on the platform, not federated. Makes it easier for users. B. Cells are dynamic. People can make cells, merge cells, split cells. If 50 percent of people in the R++ cell want to be more racist, they can vote to split and be moved to another cell. C. Cells are relative i.e. they exist on a map, people can compare their cell to others, any cell that exists is public and can be related to another cell. Then provide tools for organization and communication, provide tools for policing and enforcing cell dogma, and then provide the tools to allow for fundraising of whatever causes the cell deems just. Add competition between other cells. Allow it to be integrated with other social media. Make it go viral. Powerful populist movements have been built on solidarity. This is impossible in current social media which fragments political blocs creating detractors of every belief in every comment section. Remove the detractors and you have progress, radicalization. Thoughts?
nologic01 3y ago
alas they are very selective about which rights they are concerned about. e.g. very territorial about physical space, but largely numb to big tech surveillance. but indeed this issue is not aligned with traditional political divisions. there is simply no meaningful part of society that is better of from this large scale digital surveillance that is being inflicted against all people's best interest. the only beneficiary is the small oligarchy that is orchestrating this.
freedomben 3y ago
The only problem with that plan is that it's going to warp in ways that make us facepalm, especially because they like to have a named antagonist. Impossible to predict how it would go, but one thought might be that it will turn into "Bill Gates is investing in facial recognition so he can put us all in prison camps" or something. Unfortunately the damage from that will be severe and will probably make everyone on the left double down about how AI is "safe" and all that. Remember Alex Jones et al conspiracy theories about powerful people being involved in a pedophile ring? For years it was widely mocked and dismissed (including by me) and then Epstein came to light. The prediction was far from perfect, but was right in overall gist, but the suicide was largely the end of the reporting. A lawsuit here and there but very little news coverage and a lot of weird stuff was happening around that, to the point that even "regular" people think it was a conspiracy and Epstein didn't kill himself. But it went nowhere.
- gumballindie 3y ago
  That is a very real risk, but I suspect that's partially because these people have been contanstly berrated or ignored. Let's look at it this way. They felt something was wrong. Couldn't tell what but they felt it was (well some things were obious - massive job losses, ignored by the government and the media, etc). Heck even we, "highly paid" tech workers are now facing the same issues - housing is expensive, corporations want to squeeze every penny out of us, we are being manipulated, etc. Then there come people like Jones, and fill in the void, and suddenly name the issue (naturally they name a false issue, but nonetheless it sounds plausible to the untrained), and they do so in terms easy to understand. Now if they do this for a decade or longer they've successfuly radicalised people and polarised society just like we have been radicalised into thinking that these folks are just idiots and have no value. That's why we need patience, active listening to their concerns, and actual real solutions that take into account the needs of both sides. > people think it was a conspiracy and Epstein didn't kill himself The guy is not interesting nor is the gossip. What I am worried about is that there is a climate that can even lead to a conspiracy theory. It means a good chunk of people don't trust any of our institutions (EU/US/UK) - the police, the government, the media, the prison system, are all rightfully prone to being suspected of dubious acts. We haven't been therein that cell, and the revelations surrounding Epstein have shown that even people that once were considered to be trustworthy beying doubt are now less than 90% trustworthy. Us saying he did kill himself is as ridiculous as those saying he didn't. We simply don't know, we paid investigators to do their jobs with no room for doubt. Why aren't they doing it?
seydor 3y ago
that's not a bad idea
- gumballindie 3y ago
  The more I think the more I realise that some of those people's hearts are in the right place. And the amusing part is that I am starting to realise that a lot of the surveillance tech was developed under either left and right governments and politicians. Thus we can find common ground. The enemy of enemy and all that :-)

Barrin92 3y ago

the logical endpoint of that is some crazy guy shooting up a pizza place, not civil society taking back control of technology pointed at them. Ever played the original Deus Ex? There's a reason Musk on his Bob Page arc loves to stoke conspiracy nonsense and it isn't because it produces effective, rational governance reigning powerful people in

gumballindie 3y ago
> the logical endpoint of that is some crazy guy shooting up a pizza place That's the likely outcome if people are lead towards that outcome and if that's the only given option. And so far the only voices that validate their concerns are those that would benefit from such outcomes. Those that want a "better world" are too busy berrating those that have genuine concerns and as a result the only people they can take refuge in are those like Musk. It's time for genuine innovation and genuine conversation without losing track of the good in both sides.
- randysalami 3y ago
  Social platform that indexes each user based on their belief system. Create a bunch of these cells, explicit echo chambers and watch people radicalize like never before. Reddit but for fascists and only fascists; Reddit but for liberals and only liberals; Reddit for communists and only communists. Each cell acts as its own social media platform similar to how Mastodon works. The primary differences are: A. Cells are centralized on the platform, not federated. Makes it easier for users. B. Cells are dynamic. People can make cells, merge cells, split cells. If 50 percent of people in the R++ cell want to be more racist, they can vote to split and be moved to another cell. C. Cells are relative i.e. they exist on a map, people can compare their cell to others, any cell that exists is public and can be related to another cell. Then provide tools for organization and communication, provide tools for policing and enforcing cell dogma, and then provide the tools to allow for fundraising of whatever causes the cell deems just. Add competition between other cells. Allow it to be integrated with other social media. Make it go viral. Powerful populist movements have been built on solidarity. This is impossible in current social media which fragments political blocs creating detractors of every belief in every comment section. Remove the detractors and you have progress, radicalization. Thoughts?

nologic01 3y ago

alas they are very selective about which rights they are concerned about. e.g. very territorial about physical space, but largely numb to big tech surveillance. but indeed this issue is not aligned with traditional political divisions. there is simply no meaningful part of society that is better of from this large scale digital surveillance that is being inflicted against all people's best interest. the only beneficiary is the small oligarchy that is orchestrating this.

freedomben 3y ago

The only problem with that plan is that it's going to warp in ways that make us facepalm, especially because they like to have a named antagonist. Impossible to predict how it would go, but one thought might be that it will turn into "Bill Gates is investing in facial recognition so he can put us all in prison camps" or something. Unfortunately the damage from that will be severe and will probably make everyone on the left double down about how AI is "safe" and all that. Remember Alex Jones et al conspiracy theories about powerful people being involved in a pedophile ring? For years it was widely mocked and dismissed (including by me) and then Epstein came to light. The prediction was far from perfect, but was right in overall gist, but the suicide was largely the end of the reporting. A lawsuit here and there but very little news coverage and a lot of weird stuff was happening around that, to the point that even "regular" people think it was a conspiracy and Epstein didn't kill himself. But it went nowhere.

gumballindie 3y ago
That is a very real risk, but I suspect that's partially because these people have been contanstly berrated or ignored. Let's look at it this way. They felt something was wrong. Couldn't tell what but they felt it was (well some things were obious - massive job losses, ignored by the government and the media, etc). Heck even we, "highly paid" tech workers are now facing the same issues - housing is expensive, corporations want to squeeze every penny out of us, we are being manipulated, etc. Then there come people like Jones, and fill in the void, and suddenly name the issue (naturally they name a false issue, but nonetheless it sounds plausible to the untrained), and they do so in terms easy to understand. Now if they do this for a decade or longer they've successfuly radicalised people and polarised society just like we have been radicalised into thinking that these folks are just idiots and have no value. That's why we need patience, active listening to their concerns, and actual real solutions that take into account the needs of both sides. > people think it was a conspiracy and Epstein didn't kill himself The guy is not interesting nor is the gossip. What I am worried about is that there is a climate that can even lead to a conspiracy theory. It means a good chunk of people don't trust any of our institutions (EU/US/UK) - the police, the government, the media, the prison system, are all rightfully prone to being suspected of dubious acts. We haven't been therein that cell, and the revelations surrounding Epstein have shown that even people that once were considered to be trustworthy beying doubt are now less than 90% trustworthy. Us saying he did kill himself is as ridiculous as those saying he didn't. We simply don't know, we paid investigators to do their jobs with no room for doubt. Why aren't they doing it?

seydor 3y ago

that's not a bad idea

gumballindie 3y ago
The more I think the more I realise that some of those people's hearts are in the right place. And the amusing part is that I am starting to realise that a lot of the surveillance tech was developed under either left and right governments and politicians. Thus we can find common ground. The enemy of enemy and all that :-)