4 ms·

I enjoyed reading this but I also fundamentally don't get it at a basic level like... why re-implement stuff that has already been done by entire teams? There a

I enjoyed reading this but I also fundamentally don't get it at a basic level like... why re-implement stuff that has already been done by entire teams? There are so many bigger and productionised search and retrieval systems. Why invest the human capital in doing it all again yourself? I just don't get it.

ftxbro 3y ago
a lot of 'productionised' things keep getting enshittified and ruined so i don't blame anyone for remaking a wheel
lbotos 3y ago
How does one learn new things if not first by understanding them, and then looking to evolve them? Sure, we can shell out to libraries and to other people's work, but at some point, you will have to understand the thing that you've abstracted away if you want to evolve it. Or as the kids say, let him cook: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/let-him-cook-let-that-boy-cook https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/let-him-cook-let-that-boy-coo...
- ZephyrBlu 3y ago
  FYI "let him cook" is usually used in a derogatory way.
  - tanjtanjtanj 3y ago
    Not really. The original usage of it was completely positive and it has evolved into something more ironic but not necessarily negative. I think the person you were replying to used it absolutely the way most people use the phrase. It can be more or less translated to "I want to see the outcome of what they're doing" usually used after the person who is "cooking" is criticized for their methods.
catchnear4321 3y ago
someone climbed everest. others tried and didn’t make it. some didn’t make it back. people keep doing it. plenty of folks dabble in art, many of which quite poorly, when good and even great artwork can be purchased for not all that much. some paint the walls of their house rather than call a professional painter. there are countless reasons, including but not limited to the easiest, most flippant, and possibly the most human response to your question. why not?
BLKNSLVR 3y ago
I want to do my own version of something like this to have a personally curated search function. The "it's mine" factor is enticing, if it does something unexpected, then I know all the dependent, interacting parts so I can trace the problem and fix it. But I'm a privacy and self-hosting nut, which is probably just another way of saying the same thing. (I will probably never actually do it, but that doesn't stop it being on the list).
fjfuvucucuc 3y ago
Fun? Takes like two weekends to build the whitepaper version of google.
EdwardDiego 3y ago
Because you enjoy it. Because you're able to offer a product with differences in the market. Because you can. It's not like they're implementing their own DB to get to a MVP of their product "Tinder, but like for dogs".
- marginalia_nu 3y ago
  > It's not like they're implementing their own DB to get to a MVP of their product "Tinder, but like for dogs". Well, funny you should say that, https://explore.marginalia.nu/init https://explore.marginalia.nu/init
fouc 3y ago
why is bigger better? why assume that a team made something better? anybody or any team that sets out to build something will prioritize different things and end up with radically divergent implementations.
yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago
> why re-implement stuff that has already been done by entire teams Because by not being a huge team you can do it better.
- jterrys 3y ago
  It's kind of funny really, many good projects are actually maintained by a small group of people. You genuinely cannot throw more people at a project and make it faster and better. A lot of cool infra and protocol concepts stuff that we use day to day is made by a handful of people at best
  - foul 3y ago
    Quality is an opinion. Big teams are oftentimes there to improve flawlessness and appeal.
MrVandemar 3y ago
Independant efforts are as important, if not more important, than larger corporate efforts. Because independants have different priorities, and are often not as tied to satisfying curiosity instead of some bottom-line. Read any articles about how amazing Google's search is lately? Me neither.
mrkeen 3y ago
This opinion has already been expressed plenty of times.
- namaria 3y ago
  Funnily enough this repetitions encapsulates what is wrong with this reasoning. If you don't put time into learning the fundamentals, telling yourself there's not need to re-invent the wheel, you end up repeating old mistakes. Turns out computer systems are not as transparently obvious as a wheel...
marginalia_nu 3y ago
Most of what exists doesn't work for my application. It either assumes an unbounded resource budget, or makes different priorities that don't scale by e.g. permitting arbitrary realtime updates. I'm building stuff myself because it's the only way I'm aware of to run a search engine capable of indexing quarter of a billion documents on a PC.

ftxbro 3y ago

a lot of 'productionised' things keep getting enshittified and ruined so i don't blame anyone for remaking a wheel

lbotos 3y ago

How does one learn new things if not first by understanding them, and then looking to evolve them? Sure, we can shell out to libraries and to other people's work, but at some point, you will have to understand the thing that you've abstracted away if you want to evolve it. Or as the kids say, let him cook: https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/let-him-cook-let-that-boy-cook https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/let-him-cook-let-that-boy-coo...

ZephyrBlu 3y ago
FYI "let him cook" is usually used in a derogatory way.
- tanjtanjtanj 3y ago
  Not really. The original usage of it was completely positive and it has evolved into something more ironic but not necessarily negative. I think the person you were replying to used it absolutely the way most people use the phrase. It can be more or less translated to "I want to see the outcome of what they're doing" usually used after the person who is "cooking" is criticized for their methods.

catchnear4321 3y ago

someone climbed everest. others tried and didn’t make it. some didn’t make it back. people keep doing it. plenty of folks dabble in art, many of which quite poorly, when good and even great artwork can be purchased for not all that much. some paint the walls of their house rather than call a professional painter. there are countless reasons, including but not limited to the easiest, most flippant, and possibly the most human response to your question. why not?

BLKNSLVR 3y ago

I want to do my own version of something like this to have a personally curated search function. The "it's mine" factor is enticing, if it does something unexpected, then I know all the dependent, interacting parts so I can trace the problem and fix it. But I'm a privacy and self-hosting nut, which is probably just another way of saying the same thing. (I will probably never actually do it, but that doesn't stop it being on the list).

fjfuvucucuc 3y ago

Fun? Takes like two weekends to build the whitepaper version of google.

EdwardDiego 3y ago

Because you enjoy it. Because you're able to offer a product with differences in the market. Because you can. It's not like they're implementing their own DB to get to a MVP of their product "Tinder, but like for dogs".

marginalia_nu 3y ago
> It's not like they're implementing their own DB to get to a MVP of their product "Tinder, but like for dogs". Well, funny you should say that, https://explore.marginalia.nu/init https://explore.marginalia.nu/init

fouc 3y ago

why is bigger better? why assume that a team made something better? anybody or any team that sets out to build something will prioritize different things and end up with radically divergent implementations.

yjftsjthsd-h 3y ago

> why re-implement stuff that has already been done by entire teams Because by not being a huge team you can do it better.

jterrys 3y ago
It's kind of funny really, many good projects are actually maintained by a small group of people. You genuinely cannot throw more people at a project and make it faster and better. A lot of cool infra and protocol concepts stuff that we use day to day is made by a handful of people at best
- foul 3y ago
  Quality is an opinion. Big teams are oftentimes there to improve flawlessness and appeal.

MrVandemar 3y ago

Independant efforts are as important, if not more important, than larger corporate efforts. Because independants have different priorities, and are often not as tied to satisfying curiosity instead of some bottom-line. Read any articles about how amazing Google's search is lately? Me neither.

mrkeen 3y ago

This opinion has already been expressed plenty of times.

namaria 3y ago
Funnily enough this repetitions encapsulates what is wrong with this reasoning. If you don't put time into learning the fundamentals, telling yourself there's not need to re-invent the wheel, you end up repeating old mistakes. Turns out computer systems are not as transparently obvious as a wheel...

marginalia_nu 3y ago

Most of what exists doesn't work for my application. It either assumes an unbounded resource budget, or makes different priorities that don't scale by e.g. permitting arbitrary realtime updates. I'm building stuff myself because it's the only way I'm aware of to run a search engine capable of indexing quarter of a billion documents on a PC.