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I hit this invisible wall at about 165 WPM that I can't just get beyond, and it kills me. I wonder how fast I could get with stenography... I see dem 400 WPM vi

by Exuma 3y ago

I hit this invisible wall at about 165 WPM that I can't just get beyond, and it kills me. I wonder how fast I could get with stenography... I see dem 400 WPM videos and they look awesome.

jodrellblank 3y ago
The Plover / OpenSteno founder Mirabai Knight was working on Python steno a decade ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu7DygveoB4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu7DygveoB4 Longer video eight years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRFKZGWrmrM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRFKZGWrmrM Some random YouTube video, JavaScript steno seven years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBBiri3CD6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBBiri3CD6w Steno coding in Ruby, four months ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W9_k2CXrXE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W9_k2CXrXE
SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
Curious what kind of work you are doing where WPM is a limiting factor. I’m in software, like a lot of people here, so being able to type in speed is rarely the limiting factor. Besides stenographers, the only other line of work off the top of my head that needs this kind of speed are people who are paid to write subtitles for TV shows and movies in another language. Which I guess is just another form of stenography, when you unwrap it. Or is it not for work and it’s just purely to see how fast you can type?
- Exuma 3y ago
  Typing fast is one of the greatest strengths for programming for me personally, especially when compared with Vim. It's that that it's a limiting factor, but rather I max out typing quite often, and also I have always wanted to hit 200 just for fun, but it currently feels not attainable. Some people say they spend more time than they do typing, but I definitely don't find that to be the case very often.
  - SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
    I am a bit jealous (maybe?) that typing speed is a factor for you. I am the kind of person that will think for minutes at a time before writing a single line of code
    - wryanzimmerman 3y ago
      All depends on what you’re doing… sometimes people have to write, like, css.
    - Exuma 3y ago
      It's definitely situation dependent. When writing a lot of frontend code (vue, typescript, css, tailwind, html) I know what I'm typing several mental steps before I actually type it, so speed gains there are most pronounced. Sitting somewhere in the middle are dynamic languages where there might be certain implementations (say... some random api integration) where it's simply a lot of code I've typed thousands of times before. This still benefits from fast typing, especially when needing to operate surgically with vim, it's one of the moments I love the most (basically getting 20x combos with perfect typing at high speed when moving/modifying/transforming blocks of text etc etc) What benefits least of the 3 is writing things like Golang where it still definitely helps typing fast, don't get me wrong, but I usually have to think more there. Pace is slower, and symbols can become a pain in the ass. At the end of the day... you're still typing thousands of lines of code regardless of whether you're thinking or not. I never understood the argument "I spend more time thinking than coding". You are still going to write the same amount of code whether you're thinking or not. My ideal world (why I love typing fast) is that that time of me coding gets brought down by 50-200% over someone who types slow. I use that time for accelerating ahead. Ie... prototyping and deleting tons of code before refining/cementing in a design is painless.
      - SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
        for me philosophically code is a liability. Every line of code I write is a liability for me and future generations. So I try as hard as I can to not write code at all so it takes me quite a long time to decide to write code. I see it like that in the places I work too, I get paid to decide when it makes sense to write code eg introduce liability to the business
- Swizec 3y ago
  > I’m in software, like a lot of people here, so being able to type in speed is rarely the limiting factor I think of typing speed in coding the same way I think of cardio in boxing – it won’t win you the round, but the lack of it can easily lose you the round. You want topping to feel seamless and reliable. Whatever you think should come out on the keyboard reliably and without friction. Any time you have to stop and think about typing or go back to check for typos, is time you’re losing focus and flow. Take an extreme example – search-and-peck typing where every character takes 2 seconds. Can you really hold a complex programming context sharp in your mind while it takes a minute to type a few instructions? I sure couldn’t. But you probably also can’t think fast enough to fill a 200wpm typing buffer. Somewhere in between those extremes lies the sweet spot where your typing speed and your thinking speed match.
  - SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
    Interesting perspective. I have a decent wpm (like 120 if we are doing mavis beacon shit) but otherwise I usually go at like 70. I cannot think of a single time in my 10 year software engineer career where I have been like “damn, I wish I could have typed that faster and my typing speed was a limiting factor in my job”
    - Swizec 3y ago
      That’s the fun part! You don’t notice it’s a problem until you pair with someone who can’t type fast or makes a lot of typing errors and you want to bang your face through the screen because it’s so frustrating to watch them struggle. They don’t even realize they’re being held back by this. It’s an invisible friction until you notice it. Easiest way to notice the effect is by switching to a new IDE where you don’t have the keyboard shortcuts in muscle memory yet. Or a language that’s easy but you have to think about the syntax because it’s new.
  - pferde 3y ago
    Indeed, being able to type quickly is invaluable in minimizing the time your mind is blocked from continuing onwards. Or, in general, being able to use keyboard quickly. I've seen a lot of people who, when troubleshooting some issue in a SSH session, are v e r y s l o w in shell (quick sequence of little tasks like: type a command, find a particular command in your recent shell history, bring it back up, change something in it, navigate to a different directory, grep some log output). If even the simplest of those tasks takes you a few seconds, you risk losing the train of thought.
- j45 3y ago
  It might not be a limiting factor as much as an enabling factor. Sometimes being able to type fast can also mean thinking broad or deep quickly. Coding at WPM is very different than communicating at WPM. The latter might be valuable. If you can type faster you can help teammates a bit more easily. WPM isn’t a high score for me, but there’s probably a floor. Virtual assistants for example is one area where the average of 3 typeracers can be interesting. In fairness to your comment, the ability to speak to text accurately can be faster than typing too, and maybe it’s a combination of clarity meeting WPM.
- kqr 3y ago
  People conflate two things when discussing speed. Throughput is rarely the limiting factor, but latency can get in the way. Being able to type out a line of code or comment very quickly and then move on to thinking about the next one without breaking flow is useful.
Vicinity9635 3y ago
One thing I would check out is short key travel distance. I love my Bloody B975, but I know I type faster on both my Apple keyboard and especially the Magic Keyboard Folio just because of the super short travel. I can hit 80-90sh on the gaming keyboard, but I'm probably at least tickling 120 the iPad.
- Exuma 3y ago
  The newest macbook pro is 10/10 for me on typing speed. By far the best keyboard ive ever used.
  - Vicinity9635 3y ago
    [dead]

by Exuma 3y ago

I hit this invisible wall at about 165 WPM that I can't just get beyond, and it kills me. I wonder how fast I could get with stenography... I see dem 400 WPM videos and they look awesome.

jodrellblank 3y ago

The Plover / OpenSteno founder Mirabai Knight was working on Python steno a decade ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu7DygveoB4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fu7DygveoB4 Longer video eight years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRFKZGWrmrM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRFKZGWrmrM Some random YouTube video, JavaScript steno seven years ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBBiri3CD6w https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBBiri3CD6w Steno coding in Ruby, four months ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W9_k2CXrXE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3W9_k2CXrXE

SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago

Curious what kind of work you are doing where WPM is a limiting factor. I’m in software, like a lot of people here, so being able to type in speed is rarely the limiting factor. Besides stenographers, the only other line of work off the top of my head that needs this kind of speed are people who are paid to write subtitles for TV shows and movies in another language. Which I guess is just another form of stenography, when you unwrap it. Or is it not for work and it’s just purely to see how fast you can type?

Exuma 3y ago
Typing fast is one of the greatest strengths for programming for me personally, especially when compared with Vim. It's that that it's a limiting factor, but rather I max out typing quite often, and also I have always wanted to hit 200 just for fun, but it currently feels not attainable. Some people say they spend more time than they do typing, but I definitely don't find that to be the case very often.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
  I am a bit jealous (maybe?) that typing speed is a factor for you. I am the kind of person that will think for minutes at a time before writing a single line of code
  - wryanzimmerman 3y ago
    All depends on what you’re doing… sometimes people have to write, like, css.
  - Exuma 3y ago
    It's definitely situation dependent. When writing a lot of frontend code (vue, typescript, css, tailwind, html) I know what I'm typing several mental steps before I actually type it, so speed gains there are most pronounced. Sitting somewhere in the middle are dynamic languages where there might be certain implementations (say... some random api integration) where it's simply a lot of code I've typed thousands of times before. This still benefits from fast typing, especially when needing to operate surgically with vim, it's one of the moments I love the most (basically getting 20x combos with perfect typing at high speed when moving/modifying/transforming blocks of text etc etc) What benefits least of the 3 is writing things like Golang where it still definitely helps typing fast, don't get me wrong, but I usually have to think more there. Pace is slower, and symbols can become a pain in the ass. At the end of the day... you're still typing thousands of lines of code regardless of whether you're thinking or not. I never understood the argument "I spend more time thinking than coding". You are still going to write the same amount of code whether you're thinking or not. My ideal world (why I love typing fast) is that that time of me coding gets brought down by 50-200% over someone who types slow. I use that time for accelerating ahead. Ie... prototyping and deleting tons of code before refining/cementing in a design is painless.
    - SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
      for me philosophically code is a liability. Every line of code I write is a liability for me and future generations. So I try as hard as I can to not write code at all so it takes me quite a long time to decide to write code. I see it like that in the places I work too, I get paid to decide when it makes sense to write code eg introduce liability to the business
Swizec 3y ago
> I’m in software, like a lot of people here, so being able to type in speed is rarely the limiting factor I think of typing speed in coding the same way I think of cardio in boxing – it won’t win you the round, but the lack of it can easily lose you the round. You want topping to feel seamless and reliable. Whatever you think should come out on the keyboard reliably and without friction. Any time you have to stop and think about typing or go back to check for typos, is time you’re losing focus and flow. Take an extreme example – search-and-peck typing where every character takes 2 seconds. Can you really hold a complex programming context sharp in your mind while it takes a minute to type a few instructions? I sure couldn’t. But you probably also can’t think fast enough to fill a 200wpm typing buffer. Somewhere in between those extremes lies the sweet spot where your typing speed and your thinking speed match.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 3y ago
  Interesting perspective. I have a decent wpm (like 120 if we are doing mavis beacon shit) but otherwise I usually go at like 70. I cannot think of a single time in my 10 year software engineer career where I have been like “damn, I wish I could have typed that faster and my typing speed was a limiting factor in my job”
  - Swizec 3y ago
    That’s the fun part! You don’t notice it’s a problem until you pair with someone who can’t type fast or makes a lot of typing errors and you want to bang your face through the screen because it’s so frustrating to watch them struggle. They don’t even realize they’re being held back by this. It’s an invisible friction until you notice it. Easiest way to notice the effect is by switching to a new IDE where you don’t have the keyboard shortcuts in muscle memory yet. Or a language that’s easy but you have to think about the syntax because it’s new.
- pferde 3y ago
  Indeed, being able to type quickly is invaluable in minimizing the time your mind is blocked from continuing onwards. Or, in general, being able to use keyboard quickly. I've seen a lot of people who, when troubleshooting some issue in a SSH session, are v e r y s l o w in shell (quick sequence of little tasks like: type a command, find a particular command in your recent shell history, bring it back up, change something in it, navigate to a different directory, grep some log output). If even the simplest of those tasks takes you a few seconds, you risk losing the train of thought.
j45 3y ago
It might not be a limiting factor as much as an enabling factor. Sometimes being able to type fast can also mean thinking broad or deep quickly. Coding at WPM is very different than communicating at WPM. The latter might be valuable. If you can type faster you can help teammates a bit more easily. WPM isn’t a high score for me, but there’s probably a floor. Virtual assistants for example is one area where the average of 3 typeracers can be interesting. In fairness to your comment, the ability to speak to text accurately can be faster than typing too, and maybe it’s a combination of clarity meeting WPM.
kqr 3y ago
People conflate two things when discussing speed. Throughput is rarely the limiting factor, but latency can get in the way. Being able to type out a line of code or comment very quickly and then move on to thinking about the next one without breaking flow is useful.

Vicinity9635 3y ago

One thing I would check out is short key travel distance. I love my Bloody B975, but I know I type faster on both my Apple keyboard and especially the Magic Keyboard Folio just because of the super short travel. I can hit 80-90sh on the gaming keyboard, but I'm probably at least tickling 120 the iPad.

Exuma 3y ago
The newest macbook pro is 10/10 for me on typing speed. By far the best keyboard ive ever used.
- Vicinity9635 3y ago
  [dead]